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Zertz and Dvonn implementation for Windows and Linux   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #88 of 95 |
Re: Zertz and Dvonn implementation for Windows and Linux

>To quote Stephen Taverner at BGG:
Fame at last ;)
Stephen Tavener, but you got my first name correct, so you're forgiven.

>I think Zertz is just too tough to get a good AI for though...
There are two approaches that might produce a good AI. One day, I might
follow up on them, if I ever have the free time, but I'd be happy for
someone else to beat me to it.

The first approach uses a theory called - I think - UDT. Basically,
instead of a board evaluation function, you play through the whole game
using random moves; not once, but say 100,000 times. This gives you a
statistical value for the board without having to actually evaluate the
position. You then minimax, with ambiguous positions (random win/lose
ratio near the mean) automatically candidates for further moves. This
technique is apparently producing strong 9x9 and 13x13 go playing
programmes.

The second approach is a learning algorithm, that backtracks to see how
it was beaten, and builds up a pattern library of forced wins from a
given position. The important thing is to mark spaces as {must be
empty}, {must be occupied by x}, {can remove}, {don't care} but also
mark the directions from each space as {can't move in this direction},
{can move in this direction}, {don't care}, and associate the overall
pattern with the winning balls. A little bit of smartness should mean
that one defeat will let the programme recognise all reflections and
rotations of the pattern used to defeat it, and even permutations of the
balls captures/sacrificed. The same patterns should scale from 37 rings
to 48 rings, to 61 rings... which is how big I think the board should
be!

--
Stephen Tavener | There is no such thing
Games bought,sold,traded,played | as "just a cat"
http://www.scat.demon.co.uk/ | - Tanya Huff




Tue Sep 11, 2007 8:43 pm

mrraowuk
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Message #88 of 95 |
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Hi, I just released a new version of Holtz (1.2.0) which now allows to play Zertz and Dvonn locally, over network, and against a simple AI. It can also load...
Martin Trautmann
mattrautmann
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Sep 3, 2007
8:07 pm

I for one would love to help test. Can you let us know where to download the latest? I mainly have access to Windows systems but can find a Linux one if ...
Lyman Hurd
lhurd
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Sep 3, 2007
9:40 pm

Hi, sorry, I missed to mention the homepage of Holtz: http://holtz.sf.net/ Download: http://holtz.sf.net/down.php kind regards, Martin...
Martin Trautmann
mattrautmann
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Sep 3, 2007
11:54 pm

I played with the tournament rules. After trying several "standard" rules games I came to the conclusion that they are fundamentally less interesting because...
Lyman Hurd
lhurd
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Sep 4, 2007
12:40 am

Hi Lyman, thank you very much for your suggestions. ... I just had the intention to implement the rules from the board game. My instructions explained it like...
Martin Trautmann
mattrautmann
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Sep 4, 2007
9:56 am

In terms of terminology I really like the names Michael Reitz came up with: Basic Game (37 rings, 5+7+9 marbles) Standard Game (37 rings, 6+8+10 marbles) ...
Lyman Hurd
lhurd
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Sep 4, 2007
1:29 pm

Hi, ... Sounds like a great idea. The new release 1.2.1 adopted to these names. I hope all SF mirrors are already serving the new files. Martin...
Martin Trautmann
mattrautmann
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Sep 5, 2007
9:12 pm

hi Martin, thanks again for your hard work implementing these! ... To quote Stephen Taverner at BGG: "the first copies of the rings came with 37 rings, and the...
jpreen
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Sep 7, 2007
6:55 pm

... Fame at last ;) Stephen Tavener, but you got my first name correct, so you're forgiven. ... There are two approaches that might produce a good AI. One...
Stephen Tavener
mrraowuk
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Sep 11, 2007
8:47 pm

Hi James, thank you very much for testing. ... Dvonn and Zertz are currently completely independent and thus can't take player settings from one game to the...
Martin Trautmann
mattrautmann
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Sep 4, 2007
4:57 pm

I do not know what they use on LittleGolem, but I helped implement the declustering rules on Richard's PBEM server. I can send along specifics after I look ...
Lyman Hurd
lhurd
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Sep 4, 2007
6:28 pm
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