icons-rpg : Messages : 4770-4799 of 5271

I also played CoH for a long time. I was in the closed and open betas and played for the first 13 months or so. Then I lapsed for a few years and started again with 6 months of subscription just before it went F2P, and then I played off and on until the announcement earlier this year.

My favorite Mastermind was a character I called Mr. Bowler. He was a 19th Century Victorian criminal with pistols and thugs, who were the closest to the visual aesthetic I wanted.

So, if I were to do him in ICONS, I'd look at Duplication as the parent power, but I would change the flavor slightly such that the henchmen weren't actually identical.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:

�

Hello, all! The proverbial first-time post here...

One of the things I've been doing with ICONS is seeing how many of my
soon-to-be-lost City of Heroes characters I can model in it. The
answer is "a lot". But I'm a little stumped trying to figure out how
to get the essence of the mastermind down.

This is what's up with the CoH mastermind. In CoH, each character has
a primary power set and a secondary one. An awesomely agile shooter
might have Dual Pistols and Super Reflexes, for instance, while
someone with an intuitive bond to fundamental forces might have
Gravity Control and Time Manipulation. In general, the primary power
set is the heavy hitter, the thing that lets a character make her mark
on the world. In the case of masterminds, that's the kind of henchman
they summon - robots, or demons, or ninjas, and so on.

(Here's a short clip illustrating the point:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYKqP2SzAa0 - the player is mostly
telling the bots who to target, and supporting with a little bit of
trap laying. The bots do the damage.)

Now I suppose one could take the shortcut of simply taking Blast and
the like and having robots or whatever minions purely as descriptive
fodder. But I never did like that. It feels like they should matter at
least as much as ice slides and the like. But I'm a bit at a loss how
to handle them well in ICONS.

There _are_ minion rules, of course, but those are for basically
disposable NPCs. This sort of henchman/companion is substantially more
durable. It could well be that working in a simple custom riff on
Animal Control would be the thing to do. Any other options I'm
overlooking?

Regards,
Bruce

#4771

From: Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...>
Date: Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:24 pm
Subject: Re: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

mrigashirsha

Oh, hey, yeah, that would work very well for some kinds of henchmen. Thanks. :)

Maybe trickier for robots, demons, etc., but still, a starting place I wasn't thinking of!

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 4:02 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...> wrote:

�

I also played CoH for a long time. I was in the closed and open betas and played for the first 13 months or so. Then I lapsed for a few years and started again with 6 months of subscription just before it went F2P, and then I played off and on until the announcement earlier this year.

My favorite Mastermind was a character I called Mr. Bowler. He was a 19th Century Victorian criminal with pistols and thugs, who were the closest to the visual aesthetic I wanted.

So, if I were to do him in ICONS, I'd look at Duplication as the parent power, but I would change the flavor slightly such that the henchmen weren't actually identical.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:

�

Hello, all! The proverbial first-time post here...

One of the things I've been doing with ICONS is seeing how many of my
soon-to-be-lost City of Heroes characters I can model in it. The
answer is "a lot". But I'm a little stumped trying to figure out how
to get the essence of the mastermind down.

This is what's up with the CoH mastermind. In CoH, each character has
a primary power set and a secondary one. An awesomely agile shooter
might have Dual Pistols and Super Reflexes, for instance, while
someone with an intuitive bond to fundamental forces might have
Gravity Control and Time Manipulation. In general, the primary power
set is the heavy hitter, the thing that lets a character make her mark
on the world. In the case of masterminds, that's the kind of henchman
they summon - robots, or demons, or ninjas, and so on.

(Here's a short clip illustrating the point:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYKqP2SzAa0 - the player is mostly
telling the bots who to target, and supporting with a little bit of
trap laying. The bots do the damage.)

Now I suppose one could take the shortcut of simply taking Blast and
the like and having robots or whatever minions purely as descriptive
fodder. But I never did like that. It feels like they should matter at
least as much as ice slides and the like. But I'm a bit at a loss how
to handle them well in ICONS.

There _are_ minion rules, of course, but those are for basically
disposable NPCs. This sort of henchman/companion is substantially more
durable. It could well be that working in a simple custom riff on
Animal Control would be the thing to do. Any other options I'm
overlooking?

Regards,
Bruce

#4772

From: Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...>
Date: Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:43 pm
Subject: Re: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

jendarl01

I think you could use it as a model for creating a "Henchmen" power, if nothing else.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 10:24 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:

�

Oh, hey, yeah, that would work very well for some kinds of henchmen. Thanks. :)

Maybe trickier for robots, demons, etc., but still, a starting place I wasn't thinking of!

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 4:02 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...> wrote:

�

I also played CoH for a long time. I was in the closed and open betas and played for the first 13 months or so. Then I lapsed for a few years and started again with 6 months of subscription just before it went F2P, and then I played off and on until the announcement earlier this year.

My favorite Mastermind was a character I called Mr. Bowler. He was a 19th Century Victorian criminal with pistols and thugs, who were the closest to the visual aesthetic I wanted.

So, if I were to do him in ICONS, I'd look at Duplication as the parent power, but I would change the flavor slightly such that the henchmen weren't actually identical.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:

�

Hello, all! The proverbial first-time post here...

One of the things I've been doing with ICONS is seeing how many of my
soon-to-be-lost City of Heroes characters I can model in it. The
answer is "a lot". But I'm a little stumped trying to figure out how
to get the essence of the mastermind down.

This is what's up with the CoH mastermind. In CoH, each character has
a primary power set and a secondary one. An awesomely agile shooter
might have Dual Pistols and Super Reflexes, for instance, while
someone with an intuitive bond to fundamental forces might have
Gravity Control and Time Manipulation. In general, the primary power
set is the heavy hitter, the thing that lets a character make her mark
on the world. In the case of masterminds, that's the kind of henchman
they summon - robots, or demons, or ninjas, and so on.

(Here's a short clip illustrating the point:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYKqP2SzAa0 - the player is mostly
telling the bots who to target, and supporting with a little bit of
trap laying. The bots do the damage.)

Now I suppose one could take the shortcut of simply taking Blast and
the like and having robots or whatever minions purely as descriptive
fodder. But I never did like that. It feels like they should matter at
least as much as ice slides and the like. But I'm a bit at a loss how
to handle them well in ICONS.

There _are_ minion rules, of course, but those are for basically
disposable NPCs. This sort of henchman/companion is substantially more
durable. It could well be that working in a simple custom riff on
Animal Control would be the thing to do. Any other options I'm
overlooking?

Regards,
Bruce

#4773

From: Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...>
Date: Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:29 pm
Subject: Re: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

mrigashirsha

Yeah, definitely!

Hmm! Alternate Form synced with Duplication, and then customization of each form...

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 7:43 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...> wrote:

�

I think you could use it as a model for creating a "Henchmen" power, if nothing else.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 10:24 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:

�

Oh, hey, yeah, that would work very well for some kinds of henchmen. Thanks. :)

Maybe trickier for robots, demons, etc., but still, a starting place I wasn't thinking of!

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 4:02 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...> wrote:

�

I also played CoH for a long time. I was in the closed and open betas and played for the first 13 months or so. Then I lapsed for a few years and started again with 6 months of subscription just before it went F2P, and then I played off and on until the announcement earlier this year.

My favorite Mastermind was a character I called Mr. Bowler. He was a 19th Century Victorian criminal with pistols and thugs, who were the closest to the visual aesthetic I wanted.

So, if I were to do him in ICONS, I'd look at Duplication as the parent power, but I would change the flavor slightly such that the henchmen weren't actually identical.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:

�

Hello, all! The proverbial first-time post here...

One of the things I've been doing with ICONS is seeing how many of my
soon-to-be-lost City of Heroes characters I can model in it. The
answer is "a lot". But I'm a little stumped trying to figure out how
to get the essence of the mastermind down.

This is what's up with the CoH mastermind. In CoH, each character has
a primary power set and a secondary one. An awesomely agile shooter
might have Dual Pistols and Super Reflexes, for instance, while
someone with an intuitive bond to fundamental forces might have
Gravity Control and Time Manipulation. In general, the primary power
set is the heavy hitter, the thing that lets a character make her mark
on the world. In the case of masterminds, that's the kind of henchman
they summon - robots, or demons, or ninjas, and so on.

(Here's a short clip illustrating the point:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYKqP2SzAa0 - the player is mostly
telling the bots who to target, and supporting with a little bit of
trap laying. The bots do the damage.)

Now I suppose one could take the shortcut of simply taking Blast and
the like and having robots or whatever minions purely as descriptive
fodder. But I never did like that. It feels like they should matter at
least as much as ice slides and the like. But I'm a bit at a loss how
to handle them well in ICONS.

There _are_ minion rules, of course, but those are for basically
disposable NPCs. This sort of henchman/companion is substantially more
durable. It could well be that working in a simple custom riff on
Animal Control would be the thing to do. Any other options I'm
overlooking?

Regards,
Bruce

#4774

From: Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...>
Date: Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:32 pm
Subject: Re: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

jendarl01

Here's a quick draft that you could use as an idea. (Not playtested at all, but it's a starting point).

Henchmen (Control Power)

You are a born leader, and have followers that almost blindly follow your every instruction. You have a number of henchmen equal to your power level + 1, so two with Henchmen 1, three with Henchmen 2, and so forth. (The power to have virtually unlimited henchmen is off the scale.)

Your Henchmen power level is linked to your intelligence or force of personality (Intellect or Willpower) and cannot exceed your level in that ability. Reduce a rolled value above that level to your ability level. At the GM's discretion, an appropriate Specialty (such as Science) may increase the effective level of your ability.

Choose one of the following types of Henchmen. You can also make up other types with the Game Master's permission.

Robots/Zombies/other lesser-thinking creatures (Intellect) - You have used your own intelligence to create a horde of followers that are loyal to you.

Thugs/Ninjas/Other humans (Willpower) - You are extraordinarily charismatic and have convinced a group of like-minded individuals to do your bidding.

Henchmen can have ability levels that equal up to your ability levels (so if all your abilities added together are 22, each henchman can have abilities that add up to 22) except that their Intellect or Willpower must be less than your own. Each henchman can have as many Specialties as you do - 1 (minimum 1), and can choose from any Specialty available to characters. Each henchman you have can have as many powers as you do - 1 (minimum 1), and can have any power that you choose except this one or a power that has the same effects--like Time Control-summon duplicates--so that henchmen cannot have henchmen of their own. You and your henchmen share the same pool of Determination, like a team. Henchmen act as independent characters, although the GM may want to use the guidelines for cooperation with a group of henchmen (see Combining Abilities p. 57)

A dead or unconscious henchmen can only be replaced between scenes. If two or more henchmen die or are knocked unconscious in the same scene, roll a(n) Intellect or Willpower test against your power level to determine if your henchmen stick around or flee. If you are knocked out or killed, all your henchmen scatter and run away.

(Notes: I was attempting to follow the limitations inherent in Wizardry by tying the power to an ability, especially since any henchmen can effectively have any power. I broke it up to the player's choice of intellect or willpower because I was thinking of things like robots/zombies/other lesser-thinking creations for intellect, or thugs/ninjas/Bond-villain-henchmen for willpower. There might be a case to be made for Strength and clans/barbarians/aliens/etc that value might over intelligence or willpower, but I think that's a fairly weak assumption and one that doesn't really hold up well over time. Most of the "might/right" people are also smart or charismatic.)

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 10:43 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...> wrote:

I think you could use it as a model for creating a "Henchmen" power, if nothing else.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 10:24 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:

�

Oh, hey, yeah, that would work very well for some kinds of henchmen. Thanks. :)

Maybe trickier for robots, demons, etc., but still, a starting place I wasn't thinking of!

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 4:02 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...> wrote:

�

I also played CoH for a long time. I was in the closed and open betas and played for the first 13 months or so. Then I lapsed for a few years and started again with 6 months of subscription just before it went F2P, and then I played off and on until the announcement earlier this year.

My favorite Mastermind was a character I called Mr. Bowler. He was a 19th Century Victorian criminal with pistols and thugs, who were the closest to the visual aesthetic I wanted.

So, if I were to do him in ICONS, I'd look at Duplication as the parent power, but I would change the flavor slightly such that the henchmen weren't actually identical.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:

�

Hello, all! The proverbial first-time post here...

One of the things I've been doing with ICONS is seeing how many of my
soon-to-be-lost City of Heroes characters I can model in it. The
answer is "a lot". But I'm a little stumped trying to figure out how
to get the essence of the mastermind down.

This is what's up with the CoH mastermind. In CoH, each character has
a primary power set and a secondary one. An awesomely agile shooter
might have Dual Pistols and Super Reflexes, for instance, while
someone with an intuitive bond to fundamental forces might have
Gravity Control and Time Manipulation. In general, the primary power
set is the heavy hitter, the thing that lets a character make her mark
on the world. In the case of masterminds, that's the kind of henchman
they summon - robots, or demons, or ninjas, and so on.

(Here's a short clip illustrating the point:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYKqP2SzAa0 - the player is mostly
telling the bots who to target, and supporting with a little bit of
trap laying. The bots do the damage.)

Now I suppose one could take the shortcut of simply taking Blast and
the like and having robots or whatever minions purely as descriptive
fodder. But I never did like that. It feels like they should matter at
least as much as ice slides and the like. But I'm a bit at a loss how
to handle them well in ICONS.

There _are_ minion rules, of course, but those are for basically
disposable NPCs. This sort of henchman/companion is substantially more
durable. It could well be that working in a simple custom riff on
Animal Control would be the thing to do. Any other options I'm
overlooking?

Regards,
Bruce

#4775

From: Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...>
Date: Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:40 pm
Subject: Re: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

mrigashirsha

Ooh! That is very much the kind of thing I want. Off to poke and ponder more! :)

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 8:32 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...> wrote:

�

Here's a quick draft that you could use as an idea. (Not playtested at all, but it's a starting point).

Henchmen (Control Power)

You are a born leader, and have followers that almost blindly follow your every instruction. You have a number of henchmen equal to your power level + 1, so two with Henchmen 1, three with Henchmen 2, and so forth. (The power to have virtually unlimited henchmen is off the scale.)

Your Henchmen power level is linked to your intelligence or force of personality (Intellect or Willpower) and cannot exceed your level in that ability. Reduce a rolled value above that level to your ability level. At the GM's discretion, an appropriate Specialty (such as Science) may increase the effective level of your ability.

Choose one of the following types of Henchmen. You can also make up other types with the Game Master's permission.

Robots/Zombies/other lesser-thinking creatures (Intellect) - You have used your own intelligence to create a horde of followers that are loyal to you.

Thugs/Ninjas/Other humans (Willpower) - You are extraordinarily charismatic and have convinced a group of like-minded individuals to do your bidding.

Henchmen can have ability levels that equal up to your ability levels (so if all your abilities added together are 22, each henchman can have abilities that add up to 22) except that their Intellect or Willpower must be less than your own. Each henchman can have as many Specialties as you do - 1 (minimum 1), and can choose from any Specialty available to characters. Each henchman you have can have as many powers as you do - 1 (minimum 1), and can have any power that you choose except this one or a power that has the same effects--like Time Control-summon duplicates--so that henchmen cannot have henchmen of their own. You and your henchmen share the same pool of Determination, like a team. Henchmen act as independent characters, although the GM may want to use the guidelines for cooperation with a group of henchmen (see Combining Abilities p. 57)

A dead or unconscious henchmen can only be replaced between scenes. If two or more henchmen die or are knocked unconscious in the same scene, roll a(n) Intellect or Willpower test against your power level to determine if your henchmen stick around or flee. If you are knocked out or killed, all your henchmen scatter and run away.

(Notes: I was attempting to follow the limitations inherent in Wizardry by tying the power to an ability, especially since any henchmen can effectively have any power. I broke it up to the player's choice of intellect or willpower because I was thinking of things like robots/zombies/other lesser-thinking creations for intellect, or thugs/ninjas/Bond-villain-henchmen for willpower. There might be a case to be made for Strength and clans/barbarians/aliens/etc that value might over intelligence or willpower, but I think that's a fairly weak assumption and one that doesn't really hold up well over time. Most of the "might/right" people are also smart or charismatic.)

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 10:43 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...> wrote:

I think you could use it as a model for creating a "Henchmen" power, if nothing else.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 10:24 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:

�

Oh, hey, yeah, that would work very well for some kinds of henchmen. Thanks. :)

Maybe trickier for robots, demons, etc., but still, a starting place I wasn't thinking of!

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 4:02 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...> wrote:

�

I also played CoH for a long time. I was in the closed and open betas and played for the first 13 months or so. Then I lapsed for a few years and started again with 6 months of subscription just before it went F2P, and then I played off and on until the announcement earlier this year.

My favorite Mastermind was a character I called Mr. Bowler. He was a 19th Century Victorian criminal with pistols and thugs, who were the closest to the visual aesthetic I wanted.

So, if I were to do him in ICONS, I'd look at Duplication as the parent power, but I would change the flavor slightly such that the henchmen weren't actually identical.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:

�

Hello, all! The proverbial first-time post here...

One of the things I've been doing with ICONS is seeing how many of my
soon-to-be-lost City of Heroes characters I can model in it. The
answer is "a lot". But I'm a little stumped trying to figure out how
to get the essence of the mastermind down.

This is what's up with the CoH mastermind. In CoH, each character has
a primary power set and a secondary one. An awesomely agile shooter
might have Dual Pistols and Super Reflexes, for instance, while
someone with an intuitive bond to fundamental forces might have
Gravity Control and Time Manipulation. In general, the primary power
set is the heavy hitter, the thing that lets a character make her mark
on the world. In the case of masterminds, that's the kind of henchman
they summon - robots, or demons, or ninjas, and so on.

(Here's a short clip illustrating the point:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYKqP2SzAa0 - the player is mostly
telling the bots who to target, and supporting with a little bit of
trap laying. The bots do the damage.)

Now I suppose one could take the shortcut of simply taking Blast and
the like and having robots or whatever minions purely as descriptive
fodder. But I never did like that. It feels like they should matter at
least as much as ice slides and the like. But I'm a bit at a loss how
to handle them well in ICONS.

There _are_ minion rules, of course, but those are for basically
disposable NPCs. This sort of henchman/companion is substantially more
durable. It could well be that working in a simple custom riff on
Animal Control would be the thing to do. Any other options I'm
overlooking?

Regards,
Bruce

#4776

From: "dirkgentry2000" <dirkgentry2000@...>
Date: Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:09 pm
Subject: Re: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

hey - a Summon rule for handling minions was previously published (as OGL
content) in Museum Mayhem from Vigilance Press.

I just added that rule to the Icons Truth and Justice wiki

You can check it out here:
http://icons-truth-justice-and-gaming.wikispaces.com/Summon+Rule

--- In icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:
>
> Ooh! That is very much the kind of thing I want. Off to poke and ponder
> more! :)
>
> On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 8:32 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...>wrote:
>
> > **
> >
> >
> > Here's a quick draft that you could use as an idea. (Not playtested at
> > all, but it's a starting point).
> >
> > *Henchmen* *(Control Power)*
> >
> > You are a born leader, and have followers that almost blindly follow your
> > every instruction. You have a number of henchmen equal to your power level
> > + 1, so two with Henchmen 1, three with Henchmen 2, and so forth. (The
> > power to have virtually unlimited henchmen is off the scale.)
> >
> > Your Henchmen power level is linked to your intelligence or force of
> > personality (Intellect or Willpower) and cannot exceed your level in that
> > ability. Reduce a rolled value above that level to your ability level. At
> > the GM's discretion, an appropriate Specialty (such as Science) may
> > increase the effective level of your ability.
> >
> > Choose one of the following types of Henchmen. You can also make up other
> > types with the Game Master's permission.
> >
> > Robots/Zombies/other lesser-thinking creatures (Intellect) - You have used
> > your own intelligence to create a horde of followers that are loyal to you.
> >
> > Thugs/Ninjas/Other humans (Willpower) - You are extraordinarily
> > charismatic and have convinced a group of like-minded individuals to do
> > your bidding.
> >
> > Henchmen can have ability levels that equal up to your ability levels (so
> > if all your abilities added together are 22, each henchman can have
> > abilities that add up to 22) except that their Intellect or Willpower must
> > be less than your own. Each henchman can have as many Specialties as you do
> > - 1 (minimum 1), and can choose from any Specialty available to characters.
> > Each henchman you have can have as many powers as you do - 1 (minimum 1),
> > and can have any power that you choose except this one or a power that has
> > the same effects--like Time Control-summon duplicates--so that henchmen
> > cannot have henchmen of their own. You and your henchmen share the same
> > pool of Determination, like a team. Henchmen act as independent characters,
> > although the GM may want to use the guidelines for cooperation with a group
> > of henchmen (see Combining Abilities p. 57)
> >
> > A dead or unconscious henchmen can only be replaced between scenes. If two
> > or more henchmen die or are knocked unconscious in the same scene, roll
> > a(n) Intellect or Willpower test against your power level to determine if
> > your henchmen stick around or flee. If you are knocked out or killed, all
> > your henchmen scatter and run away.
> >
> >
> >
> > (Notes: I was attempting to follow the limitations inherent in Wizardry by
> > tying the power to an ability, especially since any henchmen can
> > effectively have any power. I broke it up to the player's choice of
> > intellect or willpower because I was thinking of things like
> > robots/zombies/other lesser-thinking creations for intellect, or
> > thugs/ninjas/Bond-villain-henchmen for willpower. There might be a case to
> > be made for Strength and clans/barbarians/aliens/etc that value might over
> > intelligence or willpower, but I think that's a fairly weak assumption and
> > one that doesn't really hold up well over time. Most of the "might/right"
> > people are also smart or charismatic.)
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 10:43 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...
> > > wrote:
> >
> >> I think you could use it as a model for creating a "Henchmen" power, if
> >> nothing else.
> >>
> >>
> >> On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 10:24 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:
> >>
> >>> **
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Oh, hey, yeah, that would work very well for some kinds of henchmen.
> >>> Thanks. :)
> >>>
> >>> Maybe trickier for robots, demons, etc., but still, a starting place I
> >>> wasn't thinking of!
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 4:02 AM, Cameron Mount <
> >>> cameron.a.mount@...> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> **
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> I also played CoH for a long time. I was in the closed and open betas
> >>>> and played for the first 13 months or so. Then I lapsed for a few years
and
> >>>> started again with 6 months of subscription just before it went F2P, and
> >>>> then I played off and on until the announcement earlier this year.
> >>>>
> >>>> My favorite Mastermind was a character I called Mr. Bowler. He was a
> >>>> 19th Century Victorian criminal with pistols and thugs, who were the
> >>>> closest to the visual aesthetic I wanted.
> >>>>
> >>>> So, if I were to do him in ICONS, I'd look at Duplication as the parent
> >>>> power, but I would change the flavor slightly such that the henchmen
> >>>> weren't actually identical.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> **
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Hello, all! The proverbial first-time post here...
> >>>>>
> >>>>> One of the things I've been doing with ICONS is seeing how many of my
> >>>>> soon-to-be-lost City of Heroes characters I can model in it. The
> >>>>> answer is "a lot". But I'm a little stumped trying to figure out how
> >>>>> to get the essence of the mastermind down.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> This is what's up with the CoH mastermind. In CoH, each character has
> >>>>> a primary power set and a secondary one. An awesomely agile shooter
> >>>>> might have Dual Pistols and Super Reflexes, for instance, while
> >>>>> someone with an intuitive bond to fundamental forces might have
> >>>>> Gravity Control and Time Manipulation. In general, the primary power
> >>>>> set is the heavy hitter, the thing that lets a character make her mark
> >>>>> on the world. In the case of masterminds, that's the kind of henchman
> >>>>> they summon - robots, or demons, or ninjas, and so on.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> (Here's a short clip illustrating the point:
> >>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYKqP2SzAa0 - the player is mostly
> >>>>> telling the bots who to target, and supporting with a little bit of
> >>>>> trap laying. The bots do the damage.)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Now I suppose one could take the shortcut of simply taking Blast and
> >>>>> the like and having robots or whatever minions purely as descriptive
> >>>>> fodder. But I never did like that. It feels like they should matter at
> >>>>> least as much as ice slides and the like. But I'm a bit at a loss how
> >>>>> to handle them well in ICONS.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> There _are_ minion rules, of course, but those are for basically
> >>>>> disposable NPCs. This sort of henchman/companion is substantially more
> >>>>> durable. It could well be that working in a simple custom riff on
> >>>>> Animal Control would be the thing to do. Any other options I'm
> >>>>> overlooking?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Regards,
> >>>>> Bruce
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >
> >
>

#4777

From: Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...>
Date: Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:16 pm
Subject: Re: Re: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

mrigashirsha

Oh, hey. Thank you! I've browsed some at the wiki, but, er, clearly not enough. :)

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 9:09 AM, dirkgentry2000 <dirkgentry2000@...> wrote:

�

hey - a Summon rule for handling minions was previously published (as OGL content) in Museum Mayhem from Vigilance Press.

I just added that rule to the Icons Truth and Justice wiki

You can check it out here:
http://icons-truth-justice-and-gaming.wikispaces.com/Summon+Rule

#4778

From: Fabr�cio C�sar Franco <fabfranco@...>
Date: Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:17 pm
Subject: Re: Re: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

fabfranco

http://about.me/fabfranco

Summon Rule is now open for everybody! And Cameron came up with a cool power! Two presents in one day! Yay!

2012/11/20 dirkgentry2000 <dirkgentry2000@...>

�

hey - a Summon rule for handling minions was previously published (as OGL content) in Museum Mayhem from Vigilance Press.

I just added that rule to the Icons Truth and Justice wiki

You can check it out here:
http://icons-truth-justice-and-gaming.wikispaces.com/Summon+Rule

--- In icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:
>
> Ooh! That is very much the kind of thing I want. Off to poke and ponder
> more! :)
>
> On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 8:32 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...>wrote:
>
> > **

> >
> >
> > Here's a quick draft that you could use as an idea. (Not playtested at
> > all, but it's a starting point).
> >
> > *Henchmen* *(Control Power)*

> >
> > You are a born leader, and have followers that almost blindly follow your
> > every instruction. You have a number of henchmen equal to your power level
> > + 1, so two with Henchmen 1, three with Henchmen 2, and so forth. (The
> > power to have virtually unlimited henchmen is off the scale.)
> >
> > Your Henchmen power level is linked to your intelligence or force of
> > personality (Intellect or Willpower) and cannot exceed your level in that
> > ability. Reduce a rolled value above that level to your ability level. At
> > the GM's discretion, an appropriate Specialty (such as Science) may
> > increase the effective level of your ability.
> >
> > Choose one of the following types of Henchmen. You can also make up other
> > types with the Game Master's permission.
> >
> > Robots/Zombies/other lesser-thinking creatures (Intellect) - You have used
> > your own intelligence to create a horde of followers that are loyal to you.
> >
> > Thugs/Ninjas/Other humans (Willpower) - You are extraordinarily
> > charismatic and have convinced a group of like-minded individuals to do
> > your bidding.
> >
> > Henchmen can have ability levels that equal up to your ability levels (so
> > if all your abilities added together are 22, each henchman can have
> > abilities that add up to 22) except that their Intellect or Willpower must
> > be less than your own. Each henchman can have as many Specialties as you do
> > - 1 (minimum 1), and can choose from any Specialty available to characters.
> > Each henchman you have can have as many powers as you do - 1 (minimum 1),
> > and can have any power that you choose except this one or a power that has
> > the same effects--like Time Control-summon duplicates--so that henchmen
> > cannot have henchmen of their own. You and your henchmen share the same
> > pool of Determination, like a team. Henchmen act as independent characters,
> > although the GM may want to use the guidelines for cooperation with a group
> > of henchmen (see Combining Abilities p. 57)
> >
> > A dead or unconscious henchmen can only be replaced between scenes. If two
> > or more henchmen die or are knocked unconscious in the same scene, roll
> > a(n) Intellect or Willpower test against your power level to determine if
> > your henchmen stick around or flee. If you are knocked out or killed, all
> > your henchmen scatter and run away.
> >
> >
> >
> > (Notes: I was attempting to follow the limitations inherent in Wizardry by
> > tying the power to an ability, especially since any henchmen can
> > effectively have any power. I broke it up to the player's choice of
> > intellect or willpower because I was thinking of things like
> > robots/zombies/other lesser-thinking creations for intellect, or
> > thugs/ninjas/Bond-villain-henchmen for willpower. There might be a case to
> > be made for Strength and clans/barbarians/aliens/etc that value might over
> > intelligence or willpower, but I think that's a fairly weak assumption and
> > one that doesn't really hold up well over time. Most of the "might/right"
> > people are also smart or charismatic.)
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 10:43 AM, Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...

> > > wrote:
> >
> >> I think you could use it as a model for creating a "Henchmen" power, if
> >> nothing else.
> >>
> >>
> >> On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 10:24 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:
> >>
> >>> **

> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Oh, hey, yeah, that would work very well for some kinds of henchmen.
> >>> Thanks. :)
> >>>
> >>> Maybe trickier for robots, demons, etc., but still, a starting place I
> >>> wasn't thinking of!
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 4:02 AM, Cameron Mount <
> >>> cameron.a.mount@...> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> **

> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> I also played CoH for a long time. I was in the closed and open betas
> >>>> and played for the first 13 months or so. Then I lapsed for a few years and
> >>>> started again with 6 months of subscription just before it went F2P, and
> >>>> then I played off and on until the announcement earlier this year.
> >>>>
> >>>> My favorite Mastermind was a character I called Mr. Bowler. He was a
> >>>> 19th Century Victorian criminal with pistols and thugs, who were the
> >>>> closest to the visual aesthetic I wanted.
> >>>>
> >>>> So, if I were to do him in ICONS, I'd look at Duplication as the parent
> >>>> power, but I would change the flavor slightly such that the henchmen
> >>>> weren't actually identical.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> **

> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Hello, all! The proverbial first-time post here...
> >>>>>
> >>>>> One of the things I've been doing with ICONS is seeing how many of my
> >>>>> soon-to-be-lost City of Heroes characters I can model in it. The
> >>>>> answer is "a lot". But I'm a little stumped trying to figure out how
> >>>>> to get the essence of the mastermind down.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> This is what's up with the CoH mastermind. In CoH, each character has
> >>>>> a primary power set and a secondary one. An awesomely agile shooter
> >>>>> might have Dual Pistols and Super Reflexes, for instance, while
> >>>>> someone with an intuitive bond to fundamental forces might have
> >>>>> Gravity Control and Time Manipulation. In general, the primary power
> >>>>> set is the heavy hitter, the thing that lets a character make her mark
> >>>>> on the world. In the case of masterminds, that's the kind of henchman
> >>>>> they summon - robots, or demons, or ninjas, and so on.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> (Here's a short clip illustrating the point:
> >>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYKqP2SzAa0 - the player is mostly
> >>>>> telling the bots who to target, and supporting with a little bit of
> >>>>> trap laying. The bots do the damage.)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Now I suppose one could take the shortcut of simply taking Blast and
> >>>>> the like and having robots or whatever minions purely as descriptive
> >>>>> fodder. But I never did like that. It feels like they should matter at
> >>>>> least as much as ice slides and the like. But I'm a bit at a loss how
> >>>>> to handle them well in ICONS.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> There _are_ minion rules, of course, but those are for basically
> >>>>> disposable NPCs. This sort of henchman/companion is substantially more
> >>>>> durable. It could well be that working in a simple custom riff on
> >>>>> Animal Control would be the thing to do. Any other options I'm
> >>>>> overlooking?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Regards,
> >>>>> Bruce
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >
> >
>

Twitter: www.twitter.com/fabfranco
Blog: Logomaquia
Blog:�Ludo Sapiens

#4779

From: stevekenson <stevekenson@...>
Date: Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:57 pm
Subject: Re: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

talonstudio

On Nov 20, 2012, at 8:54 AM, Bruce wrote:

In the case of masterminds, that's the kind of henchman they summon - robots, or demons, or ninjas, and so on.

Yeah, minions-as-a-power isn't one of those things ICONS does great. The rulebook touches upon it with Animation (p. 35) which is kind of a "Create-A-Minion" power. Versions of a Summoning power have shown up in supplements. This is one I'm playing around with:

SERVANT

Control. You can create or summon a creature to serve you. Your servant has Strength equal to your power level, total Prowess and Coordination equal to your power level, and Stamina equal to Strength. They have no mental abilities and only act to carry out your commands. You must concentrate to command your servant.

Generally, your servant has two powers equal to your power level: it can gain another by reducing Strength to 0. Common powers are offensive, defensive and movement.

The GM approves all servants and can veto any unsuitable concepts. Villains often have this power at a level off the scale (Icons, p. 5), able to call upon legions of servants or minions in a way unsuitable for heroes.

Stunts

Enhanced: Your servant gains Prowess and Coordination equal to your power level, rather than dividing your power level between the two abilities.
Extra Servant: You have two servants of the same type. Each time you add this stunt, you gain an extra servant.
Sensory Link: You can perceive through the senses of your servant, seeing and hearing everything they do.
Split: You can divide your power level amongst multiple servants; rather than summoning one at level 8, for example, you could summon four level 2 servants.

There's also the issue of handling large numbers of minions: should they be summed up as a "swarm" type or given individual tests? Certainly, it's better to handle a swarm of trained bees as one entity but a mob of mind-controlled people might be another thing.

_____
Steve Kenson
stevekenson@...
www.stevekenson.com

#4780

From: "dirkgentry2000" <dirkgentry2000@...>
Date: Tue Nov 20, 2012 6:00 pm
Subject: Vehicle Rule now in Wiki

Earlier this year, Fainting Goat Games published Vehicle and Chase rules for
ICONS (written by myself and Daniel Gallant with consultation from Steve Kenson)

I decided to go ahead and put these rules into the Truth and Justice wiki. You
can check them out here:

http://icons-truth-justice-and-gaming.wikispaces.com/Vehicle+and+Chase+Rules

Reply | Messages in this Topic (1)

#4781

From: Soylent Green <gsoylent@...>
Date: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:48 pm
Subject: RE: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

gsoylent

Ah yes. I had a Pistols/Thugs mastermind too. She was so much fun I soloed her all teh way to 50 without even noticing. Nothing quite prepares you for the thrill of seeing your brute arriving on a motorcycle for the first time!

As for converting this to Icons, I'd be tempted to take Plant Control as a model. I am not saying thugs are just vegetables, but in ICONS mechanics term they might as well be. To simulate the multiple minions effect I'd allow the player to select this power multiple times as a bonus power - each rolled individually and each time times its selected counting towards the starting DP pool.

To: icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com
From: cameron.a.mount@...
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2012 07:02:00 -0500
Subject: Re: [icons-rpg] Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

My favorite Mastermind was a character I called Mr. Bowler. He was a 19th Century Victorian criminal with pistols and thugs, who were the closest to the visual aesthetic I wanted.

So, if I were to do him in ICONS, I'd look at Duplication as the parent power, but I would change the flavor slightly such that the henchmen weren't actually identical.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:

Hello, all! The proverbial first-time post here...

One of the things I've been doing with ICONS is seeing how many of my
soon-to-be-lost City of Heroes characters I can model in it. The
answer is "a lot". But I'm a little stumped trying to figure out how
to get the essence of the mastermind down.

This is what's up with the CoH mastermind. In CoH, each character has
a primary power set and a secondary one. An awesomely agile shooter
might have Dual Pistols and Super Reflexes, for instance, while
someone with an intuitive bond to fundamental forces might have
Gravity Control and Time Manipulation. In general, the primary power
set is the heavy hitter, the thing that lets a character make her mark
on the world. In the case of masterminds, that's the kind of henchman
they summon - robots, or demons, or ninjas, and so on.

(Here's a short clip illustrating the point:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYKqP2SzAa0 - the player is mostly
telling the bots who to target, and supporting with a little bit of
trap laying. The bots do the damage.)

Now I suppose one could take the shortcut of simply taking Blast and
the like and having robots or whatever minions purely as descriptive
fodder. But I never did like that. It feels like they should matter at
least as much as ice slides and the like. But I'm a bit at a loss how
to handle them well in ICONS.

There _are_ minion rules, of course, but those are for basically
disposable NPCs. This sort of henchman/companion is substantially more
durable. It could well be that working in a simple custom riff on
Animal Control would be the thing to do. Any other options I'm
overlooking?

Regards,
Bruce

#4782

From: Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...>
Date: Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:12 pm
Subject: Re: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

jendarl01

That's actually a really good idea, too.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 5:48 PM, Soylent Green <gsoylent@...> wrote:

�

Ah yes. I had a�Pistols/Thugs mastermind too. She was so much fun I soloed her all teh way to 50 without even noticing. Nothing quite prepares you for the thrill of seeing your brute arriving on�a motorcycle for the first time!

As for converting this to Icons, I'd be tempted to take Plant Control as a model. I am not saying thugs are just vegetables, but in ICONS mechanics term they might as well be. To simulate the multiple minions effect I'd allow the player to select this power multiple times as a bonus power - each rolled individually and each time times its selected �counting towards the starting DP pool.
�

�

To: icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com
From: cameron.a.mount@...
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2012 07:02:00 -0500
Subject: Re: [icons-rpg] Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

�

I also played CoH for a long time. I was in the closed and open betas and played for the first 13 months or so. Then I lapsed for a few years and started again with 6 months of subscription just before it went F2P, and then I played off and on until the announcement earlier this year.

My favorite Mastermind was a character I called Mr. Bowler. He was a 19th Century Victorian criminal with pistols and thugs, who were the closest to the visual aesthetic I wanted.

So, if I were to do him in ICONS, I'd look at Duplication as the parent power, but I would change the flavor slightly such that the henchmen weren't actually identical.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Bruce Baugh <bbaugh@...> wrote:

�

Hello, all! The proverbial first-time post here...

One of the things I've been doing with ICONS is seeing how many of my
soon-to-be-lost City of Heroes characters I can model in it. The
answer is "a lot". But I'm a little stumped trying to figure out how
to get the essence of the mastermind down.

This is what's up with the CoH mastermind. In CoH, each character has
a primary power set and a secondary one. An awesomely agile shooter
might have Dual Pistols and Super Reflexes, for instance, while
someone with an intuitive bond to fundamental forces might have
Gravity Control and Time Manipulation. In general, the primary power
set is the heavy hitter, the thing that lets a character make her mark
on the world. In the case of masterminds, that's the kind of henchman
they summon - robots, or demons, or ninjas, and so on.

(Here's a short clip illustrating the point:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYKqP2SzAa0 - the player is mostly
telling the bots who to target, and supporting with a little bit of
trap laying. The bots do the damage.)

Now I suppose one could take the shortcut of simply taking Blast and
the like and having robots or whatever minions purely as descriptive
fodder. But I never did like that. It feels like they should matter at
least as much as ice slides and the like. But I'm a bit at a loss how
to handle them well in ICONS.

There _are_ minion rules, of course, but those are for basically
disposable NPCs. This sort of henchman/companion is substantially more
durable. It could well be that working in a simple custom riff on
Animal Control would be the thing to do. Any other options I'm
overlooking?

Regards,
Bruce

#4783

From: Bruce Baugh <mrigashirsha@...>
Date: Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:26 am
Subject: Re: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

mrigashirsha

Yeah, that definitely works as well, focusing on the effects that get delivered. How'd you handle attacks aimed at the henchentities?

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 2:48 PM, Soylent Green <gsoylent@...> wrote:

�

Ah yes. I had a�Pistols/Thugs mastermind too. She was so much fun I soloed her all teh way to 50 without even noticing. Nothing quite prepares you for the thrill of seeing your brute arriving on�a motorcycle for the first time!

As for converting this to Icons, I'd be tempted to take Plant Control as a model. I am not saying thugs are just vegetables, but in ICONS mechanics term they might as well be. To simulate the multiple minions effect I'd allow the player to select this power multiple times as a bonus power - each rolled individually and each time times its selected �counting towards the starting DP pool.

#4784

From: Soylent Green <gsoylent@...>
Date: Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:00 am
Subject: RE: Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

gsoylent

With Plant Control I always just assumed that the plant-minions had Stamina points equal to the power's rank. Rereading the power I now realise that is not actually in the rules.

That tends to happen a lot to me with ICONS, the boundary between the rules as written and my own interpretation and extrapolations tends to get pretty fuzzy. I've also deliberately made the same exact power work differently for different characters because that is what made sense for that character.

To: icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com
From: mrigashirsha@...
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2012 20:26:52 -0800
Subject: Re: [icons-rpg] Powerful minions/henchmen/etc for heroes

Yeah, that definitely works as well, focusing on the effects that get delivered. How'd you handle attacks aimed at the henchentities?

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 2:48 PM, Soylent Green <gsoylent@...> wrote:

Ah yes. I had a Pistols/Thugs mastermind too. She was so much fun I soloed her all teh way to 50 without even noticing. Nothing quite prepares you for the thrill of seeing your brute arriving on a motorcycle for the first time!

As for converting this to Icons, I'd be tempted to take Plant Control as a model. I am not saying thugs are just vegetables, but in ICONS mechanics term they might as well be. To simulate the multiple minions effect I'd allow the player to select this power multiple times as a bonus power - each rolled individually and each time times its selected counting towards the starting DP pool.

#4785

From: "dirkgentry2000" <dirkgentry2000@...>
Date: Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:08 pm
Subject: Stark City update

the new BAMFcast has an update on the progress of Stark City and touches on a
few other topics.
Dan Houser and Walt Robillard co-host
http://tinyurl.com/bfqjbpz

#4786

From: Bill <plusonesword@...>
Date: Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:35 pm
Subject: Re: Stark City update

plusonesword

I have to admit that I was waiting on the edge of my seat to see if my character might possible get mentioned ;-)

On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 11:08 AM, dirkgentry2000 <dirkgentry2000@...> wrote:

�

the new BAMFcast has an update on the progress of Stark City and touches on a few other topics.
Dan Houser and Walt Robillard co-host
http://tinyurl.com/bfqjbpz

#4787

From: Bruce Baugh <mrigashirsha@...>
Date: Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:45 pm
Subject: Wraith: The Iconoclasm

mrigashirsha

Back in the day, I was one of the writers for White Wolf's game of
playing ghosts, Wraith: The Oblivion. I continue to love the setting,
but always felt that some of the mechanics needed some loving
overhaul. One of my pet things to do with new-to-me games is see how
they work for adapting. Wraith. Now it's ICONS's turn.

The title is a gift from Craig Oxbrow, to whom much thanks.

https://plus.google.com/107122403431806926287/posts/UeCSWZiX2qD - a
first look at abilities and powers.

https://plus.google.com/107122403431806926287/posts/HvqMkEfDfkS -
Shadow-related mechanics and ideas.

There will likely be more, as I'm having fun doing it.

At the moment this is all very insider-y - if you look at it without
knowing Wraith, I can't think it'll do you much good, but I'd like to
hear your thoughts if any of it seems interesting anyway. Writing a
guide for newcomers with more polished versions of this stuff might be
fun.

Regards,
Bruce

Reply | Messages in this Topic (2)

#4788

From: Bill <plusonesword@...>
Date: Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:09 pm
Subject: Re: Wraith: The Iconoclasm

plusonesword

I feel like for ICONS, I'd want to go light on the shadow mechanics. Instead of having Challenges for bad aspects, I'd repurpose all of that stuff into the Shadow Mechanic. Then any kind of interaction you have with your shadow would take the form of compels against your challenges.

I feel like I've seen an alternate Damage tracks system for ICONS which covers certain specialized situations but I can't seem to find it. The basic idea as I remember it was that everyone had a 3 (or 4 or 5) hit track for whatever they were up against that could be brought up and down by damage and recovery. Three web hits for instance and you were hog tied. In addition to stamina and webbing, one of these could be Soul and bad stuff happens when you get down to zero.

On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 11:45 AM, Bruce Baugh <mrigashirsha@...> wrote:

�

Back in the day, I was one of the writers for White Wolf's game of
playing ghosts, Wraith: The Oblivion. I continue to love the setting,
but always felt that some of the mechanics needed some loving
overhaul. One of my pet things to do with new-to-me games is see how
they work for adapting. Wraith. Now it's ICONS's turn.

The title is a gift from Craig Oxbrow, to whom much thanks.

https://plus.google.com/107122403431806926287/posts/UeCSWZiX2qD - a
first look at abilities and powers.

https://plus.google.com/107122403431806926287/posts/HvqMkEfDfkS -
Shadow-related mechanics and ideas.

There will likely be more, as I'm having fun doing it.

At the moment this is all very insider-y - if you look at it without
knowing Wraith, I can't think it'll do you much good, but I'd like to
hear your thoughts if any of it seems interesting anyway. Writing a
guide for newcomers with more polished versions of this stuff might be
fun.

Regards,
Bruce

Reply | Messages in this Topic (2)

#4789

From: "dirkgentry2000" <dirkgentry2000@...>
Date: Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:33 pm
Subject: Re: Stark City update

Bill - I believe Dan is still working on Powerman
--- In icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com, Bill <plusonesword@...> wrote:
>
> I have to admit that I was waiting on the edge of my seat to see if my
> character might possible get mentioned ;-)
>
> On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 11:08 AM, dirkgentry2000
> <dirkgentry2000@...>wrote:
>
> > **
> >
> >
> > the new BAMFcast has an update on the progress of Stark City and touches
> > on a few other topics.
> > Dan Houser and Walt Robillard co-host
> > http://tinyurl.com/bfqjbpz
> >
> >
> >
>

#4790

From: Bill <plusonesword@...>
Date: Wed Nov 21, 2012 7:03 pm
Subject: Re: Re: Stark City update

plusonesword

Obviously when you're as powerful as Powerman... it takes time. You don't want to overload.

On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 1:33 PM, dirkgentry2000 <dirkgentry2000@...> wrote:

�

Bill - I believe Dan is still working on Powerman

--- In icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com, Bill <plusonesword@...> wrote:
>
> I have to admit that I was waiting on the edge of my seat to see if my
> character might possible get mentioned ;-)
>
> On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 11:08 AM, dirkgentry2000
> <dirkgentry2000@...>wrote:
>
> > **

> >
> >
> > the new BAMFcast has an update on the progress of Stark City and touches
> > on a few other topics.
> > Dan Houser and Walt Robillard co-host
> > http://tinyurl.com/bfqjbpz
> >
> >
> >
>

#4791

From: "dirkgentry2000" <dirkgentry2000@...>
Date: Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:57 pm
Subject: New Justice Wheels: MAKO Commander

The latest Justice Wheels is a loving tribute to comic book terrorist
organizations everywhere.

Written by Joe Bardales and with art by Jacob Blackmon, Justice Wheels #13
features the MAKO Commander, (leader of an top secret, water-based, highly
organized terrorist organization) and his flying shark submarine. Included (for
free!) is a MAKO trooper in a battle-pod.

Check it out here for just a buck
http://tinyurl.com/bos424k

Reply | Messages in this Topic (1)

#4792

From: John McMullen <jhmcmullen@...>
Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 7:34 pm
Subject: Why would a small town have superheroes?

jhmcmullen

I'm sitting working and listening to one of the Vigilance Press actual play podcasts, dealing with Mutants & Masterminds and Beacon City, and that made me wonder about small towns. Namely, campaigns are usually set in large cities. The reasons for cities are obvious: traffic, a reason for people (that is, supervillains) to come and go. You can have a revolving door for the bad guys.

But a small town (my folks lived in small towns, and I spent the majority of weekends in my kidhood either on farms or in small towns) strikes me as a different kind of environment, and it might be interesting.

There are lots of ways to have a one-shot or an adventure set in a small town. (Murder of Crowes, for instance, just to be ICONS-specific.) But an on-going campaign is a bit harder.

One of the ways is to have the Meteor Monster of the Week thing that they had the first season or two in Smallville. Essentially, whatever makes supers is in town: it could be that the town is built on a Hellmouth (not every one ends up having a city).

Another way is for the supers to come to it. For instance, if your small town is trying to increase its population by being a retirement community, and a lot of ex-spies or former superheroes or operatives move there because it's cheap, people with grudges or children who have been taught that they have to hate The Velvet Mallet of Justice or something, well, they'll show up.

Or you can just claim that the popular teleportation spell that the planet's Master Magus uses goes through town, and some of them get out...

Other ideas?

John McMullen (Searching for a .sig)
jhmcmullen@...

#4793

From: Nicholas Clements <nick@...>
Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 7:49 pm
Subject: Re: Why would a small town have superheroes?

doc2clem

we played a great campaign set in a small town where a rogue scientist from a government project introduced a retrovirus into the town water supply

my (bad) write up is at

Changes - RPGnet Forums

we ran two TV "seasons" and great fun was had by all. the basic understanding was that the pcs were designed as ordinary small town folk, and each had to name one relative, one friend and one workmate, so there were NPCs they had a stake in straight away - oh, and we designed classic power "sets", but no-one knew what they would get, as they were allocated at random. Watching pcs trying to work out whether they were actually bullet proof or not was.... interesting

On 23 Nov 2012, at 19:34, John McMullen wrote:

I'm sitting working and listening to one of the Vigilance Press actual play podcasts, dealing with Mutants & Masterminds and Beacon City, and that made me wonder about small towns. Namely, campaigns are usually set in large cities. The reasons for cities are obvious: traffic, a reason for people (that is, supervillains) to come and go. You can have a revolving door for the bad guys.

But a small town (my folks lived in small towns, and I spent the majority of weekends in my kidhood either on farms or in small towns) strikes me as a different kind of environment, and it might be interesting.

There are lots of ways to have a one-shot or an adventure set in a small town. (Murder of Crowes, for instance, just to be ICONS-specific.) But an on-going campaign is a bit harder.

One of the ways is to have the Meteor Monster of the Week thing that they had the first season or two in Smallville. Essentially, whatever makes supers is in town: it could be that the town is built on a Hellmouth (not every one ends up having a city).

Another way is for the supers to come to it. For instance, if your small town is trying to increase its population by being a retirement community, and a lot of ex-spies or former superheroes or operatives move there because it's cheap, people with grudges or children who have been taught that they have to hate The Velvet Mallet of Justice or something, well, they'll show up.

Or you can just claim that the popular teleportation spell that the planet's Master Magus uses goes through town, and some of them get out...

Other ideas?

John McMullen (Searching for a .sig)
jhmcmullen@...

#4794

From: Soylent Green <gsoylent@...>
Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 7:57 pm
Subject: RE: Why would a small town have superheroes?

gsoylent

I think small town works better for the street level vigilante hero like Daredevil. Small towns can still have crime; drugs, smuggling, arms and even human trafficking can easily go through a smaller town.

In fact a small can even be under the complete controlled by a powerful gangsters more so than a metropolis which in turn means the injustice can be much more in the open. For inspiration think about all those classic Westerns where lone white-hat stands alone against on the crooked cattle baron who runs the town. That's the small town superhero.

To: icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com
From: jhmcmullen@...
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2012 11:34:10 -0800
Subject: [icons-rpg] Why would a small town have superheroes?

There are lots of ways to have a one-shot or an adventure set in a small town. (Murder of Crowes, for instance, just to be ICONS-specific.) But an on-going campaign is a bit harder.

Or you can just claim that the popular teleportation spell that the planet's Master Magus uses goes through town, and some of them get out...

Other ideas?

John McMullen (Searching for a .sig)
jhmcmullen@...

#4795

From: Gerry <urbwarzine@...>
Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 8:29 pm
Subject: RE: Why would a small town have superheroes?

urbwar

>From: Soylent Green
>I think small town works better for the street level vigilante hero like Daredevil. Small towns can still have crime; drugs, smuggling, arms and even human trafficking can easily go through a smaller >town. In fact a small can even be under the complete controlled by a powerful gangsters more so than a metropolis which in turn means the injustice can be much more in the open. For inspiration

> think about all those classic Westerns where lone white-hat stands alone against on the crooked cattle baron who runs the town. That's the small town superhero.

Just watch shows like Justified, Longmire and/or Sons of Anarchy for crime taking place in smaller towns. All 3 are based in towns/rural areas for the most part, and show various criminal acts (drug dealing, gun running, prostitution, etc). Perfect fodder for a vigilante type


Soultaker Studios Blog: http://soultakerstudios.blogspot.com/

#4796

From: Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...>
Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 8:31 pm
Subject: Re: Why would a small town have superheroes?

jendarl01

Near the small towns I grew up were thing like factories (the M&M plant, for instance), research facilities (Hoffman-LaRoche), and chemical plants (BASF). And that was all within 15 minutes of where I grew up.

Just some ideas from real life that could be used in a game.

On Nov 23, 2012, at 14:49, Nicholas Clements <nick@...> wrote:

we played a great campaign set in a small town where a rogue scientist from a government project introduced a retrovirus into the town water supply

my (bad) write up is at

Changes - RPGnet Forums

we ran two TV "seasons" and great fun was had by all. the basic understanding was that the pcs were designed as ordinary small town folk, and each had to name one relative, one friend and one workmate, so there were NPCs they had a stake in straight away - oh, and we designed classic power "sets", but no-one knew what they would get, as they were allocated at random. Watching pcs trying to work out whether they were actually bullet proof or not was.... interesting

On 23 Nov 2012, at 19:34, John McMullen wrote:

I'm sitting working and listening to one of the Vigilance Press actual play podcasts, dealing with Mutants & Masterminds and Beacon City, and that made me wonder about small towns. Namely, campaigns are usually set in large cities. The reasons for cities are obvious: traffic, a reason for people (that is, supervillains) to come and go. You can have a revolving door for the bad guys.

But a small town (my folks lived in small towns, and I spent the majority of weekends in my kidhood either on farms or in small towns) strikes me as a different kind of environment, and it might be interesting.

There are lots of ways to have a one-shot or an adventure set in a small town. (Murder of Crowes, for instance, just to be ICONS-specific.) But an on-going campaign is a bit harder.

One of the ways is to have the Meteor Monster of the Week thing that they had the first season or two in Smallville. Essentially, whatever makes supers is in town: it could be that the town is built on a Hellmouth (not every one ends up having a city).

Another way is for the supers to come to it. For instance, if your small town is trying to increase its population by being a retirement community, and a lot of ex-spies or former superheroes or operatives move there because it's cheap, people with grudges or children who have been taught that they have to hate The Velvet Mallet of Justice or something, well, they'll show up.

Or you can just claim that the popular teleportation spell that the planet's Master Magus uses goes through town, and some of them get out...

Other ideas?

John McMullen (Searching for a .sig)
jhmcmullen@...

#4797

From: John McMullen <jhmcmullen@...>
Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 8:46 pm
Subject: Re: Why would a small town have superheroes?

jhmcmullen

That's interesting, Cameron. Do you mind my asking what area? Tell me off-list, if you want to.

The small towns I have spent significant time in are all on the Bruce peninsula in Ontario: lots of dairy and beef as the main industries, and towns exist primarily to serve the farms. More recently, my in-laws had a B&B in Port Elgin, which actually has some tourist trade and even some cross-border boating--but nearby Tara does not. (And in between there are three buildings that they swear was once a town...)

If you get into the more southern parts of southern Ontario (none of this is really middle or northern Ontario), you start to get the tobacco farms and you start to see some factories and research--but that area is increasingly urbaniized; towns or villages are minutes apart by car, rather than tens of minutes.

In middle Ontario, towns tend to be more mining operations, and are half an hour or an hour apart. (I wouldn't claim that I've ever been to northern Ontario, and the times I've spent driving in Alberta largely skipped towns.)

When I was driving in rural Ohio, I remember that one town almost blended into the next, usually separated by two barns. (That might be an artifact of where I was; I'm not claiming it's true of the whole state.) You can't call it suburban in the "minivan and mall" sense, but it's not rural in the "corn as high as an elephant's eye" sense, either.

So I'd have to pick the area, too, to decide what "small town" means. (Maybe that Manitoba town, pop. 550, that's selling property lots for $10 to encourage growth.)

John McMullen (Searching for a .sig)
jhmcmullen@...

From: Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...>
To: "icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com" <icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, November 23, 2012 3:31 PM
Subject: Re: [icons-rpg] Why would a small town have superheroes?

Just some ideas from real life that could be used in a game.

On Nov 23, 2012, at 14:49, Nicholas Clements <nick@...> wrote:

we played a great campaign set in a small town where a rogue scientist from a government project introduced a retrovirus into the town water supply

my (bad) write up is at

Changes - RPGnet Forums

we ran two TV "seasons" and great fun was had by all. the basic understanding was that the pcs were designed as ordinary small town folk, and each had to name one relative, one friend and one workmate, so there were NPCs they had a stake in straight away - oh, and we designed classic power "sets", but no-one knew what they would get, as they were allocated at random. Watching pcs trying to work out whether they were actually bullet proof or not was.... interesting

On 23 Nov 2012, at 19:34, John McMullen wrote:

I'm sitting working and listening to one of the Vigilance Press actual play podcasts, dealing with Mutants & Masterminds and Beacon City, and that made me wonder about small towns. Namely, campaigns are usually set in large cities. The reasons for cities are obvious: traffic, a reason for people (that is, supervillains) to come and go. You can have a revolving door for the bad guys.

But a small town (my folks lived in small towns, and I spent the majority of weekends in my kidhood either on farms or in small towns) strikes me as a different kind of environment, and it might be interesting.

There are lots of ways to have a one-shot or an adventure set in a small town. (Murder of Crowes, for instance, just to be ICONS-specific.) But an on-going campaign is a bit harder.

One of the ways is to have the Meteor Monster of the Week thing that they had the first season or two in Smallville. Essentially, whatever makes supers is in town: it could be that the town is built on a Hellmouth (not every one ends up having a city).

Another way is for the supers to come to it. For instance, if your small town is trying to increase its population by being a retirement community, and a lot of ex-spies or former superheroes or operatives move there because it's cheap, people with grudges or children who have been taught that they have to hate The Velvet Mallet of Justice or something, well, they'll show up.

Or you can just claim that the popular teleportation spell that the planet's Master Magus uses goes through town, and some of them get out...

Other ideas?

John McMullen (Searching for a .sig)
jhmcmullen@...

#4798

From: John Dunn <john.dunn@...>
Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 9:00 pm
Subject: Re: Why would a small town have superheroes?

the_dunner

Aaron Williams' PS238 may epitomize the "coming to it" approach. For the beginning of that comic's run, it was clear that the school was deliberated located far from any kind of major city. The intent being that the students could work in complete isolation. Villains might target the school as an effort to reach the young, or they might just be after the research notes from some of the instructors. Of course, depending upon the level of super science in the campaign setting, the physical distance might not be an issue. If everyone has access to teleporter technology, no place is really functionally isolated by physical distance.

This might play out similar to the retirement community mentioned in the original post.

Another possibility could be to riff on the Initiative from Buffy. A secret training organization might be present near the small town because of its isolation. As the facility grew, this could cause a pretty significant shift in the types of people residing within the small community.

The Impulse comic series placed the title character in a small Southern town as part of his training. The setting worked well because of the sharp contrasts with the character's impatience and spontaneity. Making that work for a larger (and more random) cast of characters might be considerably more challenging.

-John
www.meliorvia.com

#4799

From: Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...>
Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 9:14 pm
Subject: Re: Why would a small town have superheroes?

jendarl01

I grew up in rural NJ. The town is called Hope. 15 minutes southeast is Hackettstown where M&M is headquartered. And 1o minutes south and west is Belvidere which had the BASF and LaRoche plants. (Incidentally, large portions of the original Friday the 13th movie were filmed in Hope, with other segments filmed in nearby Blairstown (10 minutes north and east).

On Nov 23, 2012, at 15:46, John McMullen <jhmcmullen@...> wrote:

That's interesting, Cameron. Do you mind my asking what area? Tell me off-list, if you want to.

The small towns I have spent significant time in are all on the Bruce peninsula in Ontario: lots of dairy and beef as the main industries, and towns exist primarily to serve the farms. More recently, my in-laws had a B&B in Port Elgin, which actually has some tourist trade and even some cross-border boating--but nearby Tara does not. (And in between there are three buildings that they swear was once a town...)

If you get into the more southern parts of southern Ontario (none of this is really middle or northern Ontario), you start to get the tobacco farms and you start to see some factories and research--but that area is increasingly urbaniized; towns or villages are minutes apart by car, rather than tens of minutes.

In middle Ontario, towns tend to be more mining operations, and are half an hour or an hour apart. (I wouldn't claim that I've ever been to northern Ontario, and the times I've spent driving in Alberta largely skipped towns.)

When I was driving in rural Ohio, I remember that one town almost blended into the next, usually separated by two barns. (That might be an artifact of where I was; I'm not claiming it's true of the whole state.) You can't call it suburban in the "minivan and mall" sense, but it's not rural in the "corn as high as an elephant's eye" sense, either.

So I'd have to pick the area, too, to decide what "small town" means. (Maybe that Manitoba town, pop. 550, that's selling property lots for $10 to encourage growth.)

John McMullen (Searching for a .sig)
jhmcmullen@...

From: Cameron Mount <cameron.a.mount@...>
To: "icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com" <icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, November 23, 2012 3:31 PM
Subject: Re: [icons-rpg] Why would a small town have superheroes?

Near the small towns I grew up were thing like factories (the M&M plant, for instance), research facilities (Hoffman-LaRoche), and chemical plants (BASF). And that was all within 15 minutes of where I grew up.

Just some ideas from real life that could be used in a game.

On Nov 23, 2012, at 14:49, Nicholas Clements <nick@...> wrote:

we played a great campaign set in a small town where a rogue scientist from a government project introduced a retrovirus into the town water supply

my (bad) write up is at

Changes - RPGnet Forums

we ran two TV "seasons" and great fun was had by all. the basic understanding was that the pcs were designed as ordinary small town folk, and each had to name one relative, one friend and one workmate, so there were NPCs they had a stake in straight away - oh, and we designed classic power "sets", but no-one knew what they would get, as they were allocated at random. Watching pcs trying to work out whether they were actually bullet proof or not was.... interesting

On 23 Nov 2012, at 19:34, John McMullen wrote:

I'm sitting working and listening to one of the Vigilance Press actual play podcasts, dealing with Mutants & Masterminds and Beacon City, and that made me wonder about small towns. Namely, campaigns are usually set in large cities. The reasons for cities are obvious: traffic, a reason for people (that is, supervillains) to come and go. You can have a revolving door for the bad guys.

But a small town (my folks lived in small towns, and I spent the majority of weekends in my kidhood either on farms or in small towns) strikes me as a different kind of environment, and it might be interesting.

There are lots of ways to have a one-shot or an adventure set in a small town. (Murder of Crowes, for instance, just to be ICONS-specific.) But an on-going campaign is a bit harder.

One of the ways is to have the Meteor Monster of the Week thing that they had the first season or two in Smallville. Essentially, whatever makes supers is in town: it could be that the town is built on a Hellmouth (not every one ends up having a city).

Another way is for the supers to come to it. For instance, if your small town is trying to increase its population by being a retirement community, and a lot of ex-spies or former superheroes or operatives move there because it's cheap, people with grudges or children who have been taught that they have to hate The Velvet Mallet of Justice or something, well, they'll show up.

Or you can just claim that the popular teleportation spell that the planet's Master Magus uses goes through town, and some of them get out...

Other ideas?

John McMullen (Searching for a .sig)
jhmcmullen@...