There are several lists.  This one was from a program that generates them
randomly for you... but I think it uses this list as a basis:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess960_Enumbering_Scheme

so the arrangement you are looking for is:

#542

On Sat, 8 Apr 2006, Jeremy Good wrote:

> Hi, John.
>
> Is there an official 960 Listing? Or is that (747) taken from one
> particular, unofficial list? If so, was there any logic to that list? I know
> that Schemingmind lists them along with games that have been played but I've
> been trying to figure out if I can find which particular one falls into the
> Chess-B category so I can see the games that have been played on
> schemingmind using the Chess-B configuration (link below).
>
> http://hem.passagen.se/melki9/chessb.htm
>
> On 4/7/06, John Kipling Lewis <jklewis@...> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> I was thinking about those other 4/5th of games.  Some have pretty funny
>> castling in them.  For example:
>>
>> rknnbqrb/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RKNNBQRB w KQkq - 0 1
>>
>> I picked this from random selection. (Position Nr. 747)
>>
>> In Chess960, you need at least five moves to castle to the right from this
>> position:
>>
>>   rknnbqrb/pppppppp/8/8/8/3NNPB1/PPPPPQPP/RK4RB w KQkq - 0 1
>>
>> The resulting castle would have the King move 5 spaces and the rook 2.  I
>> suppose that's okay.  I see Kings make these kinds of moves all the
>> time...wait I mean I see Rooks make these kinds of moves all the time.
>> That's odd.  Kings shouldn't be moving so far should they?
>>
>> Rooks are meant to slide long distances.    It's what they do.  In
>> Standard Chess Castling provides a unique extra move for the King.  In
>> Chess960 that extra movement can result in remarkable rearrangment of
>> pieces, and  rather than looking like the King is jumping over a Rook
>> which just made a "normal" move next to it, it looks like the Rook is
>> jumping out of the way of a speeding King.
>>
>> rknnbqrb/pppppppp/8/8/8/3NNPB1/PPPPPQPP/R4RKB w kq - 0 1
>>
>> Ok, so what if you happen to be castling the other direction?
>>
>> rknnbqrb/pppppppp/8/8/8/3NN3/PPPPPPPP/RK2BQRB w KQkq - 0 1
>>
>> In this case you only need to move two pieces to give you the space to
>> castle.  But what's this?  The King moves one space to his right and the
>> Rook jumps three spaces.  Why in the world would a rook be jumping three
>> spaces?  And why is the King moving right to castle left??
>>
>> rknnbqrb/pppppppp/8/8/8/3NN3/PPPPPPPP/2KRBQRB w kq - 0 1
>>
>> Granted, castling is the only time you can move two pieces simultaneously,
>> so it kind of odd anyway, but all this Rook jumping business is very
>> strange!  In Standard Chess the only pieces that can jump are Knights and
>> Kings... and Kings only get to do it on their first move as part of a
>> castle.
>>
>> It really seems more like these pieces aren't Castling so much as
>> teleporting to pre-defined spaces.  Which, of course, is exactly what they
>> are doing.
>>
>> In a bid to keep the game backwards compatible with Standard Chess,
>> castling was restricted to the castling squares found in that game.  It
>> wasn't the only way to keep the game backwards compatible, but it was the
>> one choosen by Bobby Fischer.
>>
>> It also had the effect of putting the Castled pieces in familiar places to
>> Standard Chess players.  On the surface this might seem like a very good
>> thing.  Standard Chess players would be famliar with how such positions
>> are defended and how to attack them.  But I think this is counter to
>> Bobby's own intentions.  He was looking for something unfamiliar.
>> Something where you're previous (extensive) knowledge of Standard Chess
>> wouldn't give you an advantage.  A game to put those who haven't studied
>> endlessly in books a better chance of playing tactically with those that
>> have.
>>
>> So much for that, I guess.
>>
>> In the end, a game can only be as good as it's rules.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> I try to design for the length of the game -- adjusting the balance of force
> and space to produce a shorter, tactical game or a longer, calmer game
> according to the settings in which I see the game being played. I try to
> start with an idea that people will find intriguing, so they will want to
> try the game to see how that idea expresses itself on the board. I try to
> keep the rules simple, so that people writing about the game don't need to
> waste too many paragraphs explaining the rules. I try to make sure that the
> play of the game can unfold in a number of ways, that sometimes you'll get
> endgames, sometimes slashing attacks from the outset, sometimes complex
> middlegames -- but I also try to choose for each game one type of play that
> will be more likely to happen.
>
> - Ralph Betza
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

optimized chess 8H x 10W
http://www.symmetryperfect.com/shots/opti/

What started out as a puzzle has become a real game.

Despite my original intentions to the contrary, I have now christened
it but its invention should stay (somewhat) anonymous.  Although some
of you know who I am, officially this game was invented under the
nickname "Omega Man" since it does not meet my extreme standards to
take credit by given name.

Very interesting.

On Sun, 9 Apr 2006, omegamani wrote:

> optimized chess 8H x 10W
> http://www.symmetryperfect.com/shots/opti/
>
> What started out as a puzzle has become a real game.
>
> Despite my original intentions to the contrary, I have now christened
> it but its invention should stay (somewhat) anonymous.  Although some
> of you know who I am, officially this game was invented under the
> nickname "Omega Man" since it does not meet my extreme standards to
> take credit by given name.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

I don't see the name "Optimized Chess" in use on the
Chess Variants server, so the name is original.  I
think this is an excellent name for it (or "Optimized
Carrera Chess").  I personally like the NRCBQKBARN
setup (C = R + N; A = N + B), since it preserves the
traditional "kingside" and "queenside".

For what it is worth, there are 252,000 (That's
252.000 in places besides America) possible opening
setups with the Carrera pieces and the bishops on
opposite colors:

* There are 5 places to put each of the two bishops.
25 possibilities.

* For each of those posibilities, there are eight
places to put the king (200 so far)

* For each of /those/ possibilities, there are seven
places to put the queen (1400)

* Continuing, six places to put the archbishop (knight
+ bishop) (8400)

* Five places to put the marshall (rook + knight)
(42,000)

* Six ways to arrange the remaining rooks and knights
(252,000).

Since the mirror images play the same, we can reduce
this number to 126,000 possible arrangements where the
bishops are on opposite colors, and the queen is
always to the left of the king.

Now, if we insist the the queen is always to the left
of the king, and that the rooks, knights, and bishops
are symmetrically placed, then there are only 720
possible Carrera opening setups.

Furthermore, if we insist that the rooks are ouside
the knights, which are in turn outside the bishops,
and that the queen is to the left of the king, then we
only have 120 possible Carrera opening setups.

If opening theory ever makes a given Carrera setup
stale, there are plenty of other setups.  :-)

Good for people who don't like wasting time studying
openings.  Bad for people who use opening books
instead of their own resources to make their first ten
moves.

- Sam


__________________________________________________
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http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/frenchdefenceclub

1. e2-e4 e7-e6 .............

ECO Codes: C00-C19

Top level GM's: Viktor Korchnoi, Wolfgang Uhlmann, Mikhail
Botvinnik, Rafael Vaganian, Nigel Short and Alexander Morozevich
have established the playability and durability of the French.

The name of the Opening comes from a correspondence game between
London and Paris in 1836, where the French played 1...e6 and won.

Welcome to this group, you can discuss all lines from the French
Defense here.
Together with others you will be able to learn a lot!

Over 150 Chess-Bookmarks (Links).

Vive la Defense Francaise!

Regards,
Manfred Nüscheler

French Defence Club - French Defence discussion group!
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/frenchdefenceclub/

In Mirror Chess, typically Black moves are mirror images of
White moves; a variety of openings and problems arise with this
theme. Mirror Chess appeals to me as a chess variant that can
be played by a minimalist computer program and I have created
a Mirror Chess web page at:
http://www.woomerang.com/mchess/

However, I have only found a couple of links for Mirror Chess; if
anyone knows of some interesting related links, please let me
know so I can include them on the web page.

Thanks,
Jeremy Gardiner

Some presets for the newest Optimized Chess variants.

http://www.chessvariants.com/index/msdisplay.php?itemid=MSoptimizedchess

http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game%3DOptimized+Chess+8H+x+10W+-+Mir\
ror+I%26settings%3DOptimized+Chess

http://tinyurl.com/kdtoc

http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game%3DOptimized+Chess+8H+x+10W+-+Mir\
ror+II%26settings%3DOptimized+Chess

http://tinyurl.com/fk82l

http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game=Optimized%20Chess%208H%20x%2010W\
%20-%20Mirror%20I&log=judgmentality-cvgameroom-2006-107-643&userid=judgmentality

http://tinyurl.com/f7fr2

http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game=Optimized%20Chess%208H%20x%2010W\
%20-%20Mirror%20II&log=judgmentality-cvgameroom-2006-107-644&userid=judgmentalit\
y

http://tinyurl.com/gphsc

On 4/9/06, Sam Trenholme <samuel_trenholme@...> wrote:
>
> I don't see the name "Optimized Chess" in use on the
> Chess Variants server, so the name is original.  I
> think this is an excellent name for it (or "Optimized
> Carrera Chess").  I personally like the NRCBQKBARN
> setup (C = R + N; A = N + B), since it preserves the
> traditional "kingside" and "queenside".
>
> For what it is worth, there are 252,000 (That's
> 252.000 in places besides America) possible opening
> setups with the Carrera pieces and the bishops on
> opposite colors:
>
> * There are 5 places to put each of the two bishops.
> 25 possibilities.
>
> * For each of those posibilities, there are eight
> places to put the king (200 so far)
>
> * For each of /those/ possibilities, there are seven
> places to put the queen (1400)
>
> * Continuing, six places to put the archbishop (knight
> + bishop) (8400)
>
> * Five places to put the marshall (rook + knight)
> (42,000)
>
> * Six ways to arrange the remaining rooks and knights
> (252,000).
>
> Since the mirror images play the same, we can reduce
> this number to 126,000 possible arrangements where the
> bishops are on opposite colors, and the queen is
> always to the left of the king.
>
> Now, if we insist the the queen is always to the left
> of the king, and that the rooks, knights, and bishops
> are symmetrically placed, then there are only 720
> possible Carrera opening setups.
>
> Furthermore, if we insist that the rooks are ouside
> the knights, which are in turn outside the bishops,
> and that the queen is to the left of the king, then we
> only have 120 possible Carrera opening setups.
>
> If opening theory ever makes a given Carrera setup
> stale, there are plenty of other setups.  :-)
>
> Good for people who don't like wasting time studying
> openings.  Bad for people who use opening books
> instead of their own resources to make their first ten
> moves.
>
> - Sam
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Correo Yahoo!
> Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam ¡gratis!
> Regístrate ya - http://correo.espanol.yahoo.com/
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
I try to design for the length of the game -- adjusting the balance of force
and space to produce a shorter, tactical game or a longer, calmer game
according to the settings in which I see the game being played. I try to
start with an idea that people will find intriguing, so they will want to
try the game to see how that idea expresses itself on the board. I try to
keep the rules simple, so that people writing about the game don't need to
waste too many paragraphs explaining the rules. I try to make sure that the
play of the game can unfold in a number of ways, that sometimes you'll get
endgames, sometimes slashing attacks from the outset, sometimes complex
middlegames -- but I also try to choose for each game one type of play that
will be more likely to happen.

- Ralph Betza


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

There are errors in some of the presets for Optimized Chess 8H x 10W
that need to be corrected before anyone plays.

Greetings.

There was a problem when I first submitted them, with the placement of
knight and rook on one of the flanks. That problem was corrected and I hope
they're okay now. Sorry for the sloppiness.

Regards,
Jeremy

On 4/18/06, omegamani <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
> There are errors in some of the presets for Optimized Chess 8H x 10W
> that need to be corrected before anyone plays.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
I try to design for the length of the game -- adjusting the balance of force
and space to produce a shorter, tactical game or a longer, calmer game
according to the settings in which I see the game being played. I try to
start with an idea that people will find intriguing, so they will want to
try the game to see how that idea expresses itself on the board. I try to
keep the rules simple, so that people writing about the game don't need to
waste too many paragraphs explaining the rules. I try to make sure that the
play of the game can unfold in a number of ways, that sometimes you'll get
endgames, sometimes slashing attacks from the outset, sometimes complex
middlegames -- but I also try to choose for each game one type of play that
will be more likely to happen.

- Ralph Betza


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

In more detail,
http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game=Optimized%20Chess%208H%20x%2010W\
%20-%20Mirror%20II&log=judgmentality-cvgameroom-2006-107-644&userid=judgmentalit\
y
a.k.a http://tinyurl.com/gphsc was NRABQKBMRN instead
of NRABKQBMRN (the kings and queens were accidently
inverted).  I have deleted this preset.

The other three presets,
http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game%3DOptimized+Chess+8H+x+10W+-+Mir\
ror+I%26settings%3DOptimized+Chess
a.k.a http://tinyurl.com/kdtoc,
http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game%3DOptimized+Chess+8H+x+10W+-+Mir\
ror+II%26settings%3DOptimized+Chess
a.k.a http://tinyurl.com/fk82l, and
http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game=Optimized%20Chess%208H%20x%2010W\
%20-%20Mirror%20I&log=judgmentality-cvgameroom-2006-107-643&userid=judgmentality
a.k.a http://tinyurl.com/f7fr2 have the correct
NRMBQKBARN setup.

I note that Omegaman uses the "symmetric" castling for
this setup (see
http://www.chessvariants.org/index/displaycomment.php?commentid=13279
).  This is the same castling that Janus Chess uses:
"When a player castles, his king goes to the square on
the b or i-line, i.e., when a player castles short,
his king moves three squares, and when he castles
long, his king moves four squares. All other rules are
as in normal chess."  This is different from
traditional Capablanca Chess, where "the king always
moves three squares towards the rook",
Grotesque/Univers/Schoolbook Chess, where the king can
move two, three, and sometimes four squares towards
the rook, and the very flexible castling that Aberg's
variation has.

- Sam

  --- omegamani <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> escribió:

> There are errors in some of the presets for
> Optimized Chess 8H x 10W
> that need to be corrected before anyone plays.


__________________________________________________
Correo Yahoo!
Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam ¡gratis!
Regístrate ya - http://correo.espanol.yahoo.com/

http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game%3DOptimized+Chess+8H+x+10W+-+Mir\
ror+II%26settings%3DOptimized+Chess
needs to have the queen and king swapped, compare with
http://www.symmetryperfect.com/shots/opti/.  The two
Optimized setups are identical mirror images of each
other.

  --- Jeremy Good <chessvariants@...> escribió:

> Greetings.
>
> There was a problem when I first submitted them,
> with the placement of
> knight and rook on one of the flanks. That problem
> was corrected and I hope
> they're okay now. Sorry for the sloppiness.
>
> Regards,
> Jeremy
>
> On 4/18/06, omegamani <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > There are errors in some of the presets for
> Optimized Chess 8H x 10W
> > that need to be corrected before anyone plays.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> I try to design for the length of the game --
> adjusting the balance of force
> and space to produce a shorter, tactical game or a
> longer, calmer game
> according to the settings in which I see the game
> being played. I try to
> start with an idea that people will find intriguing,
> so they will want to
> try the game to see how that idea expresses itself
> on the board. I try to
> keep the rules simple, so that people writing about
> the game don't need to
> waste too many paragraphs explaining the rules. I
> try to make sure that the
> play of the game can unfold in a number of ways,
> that sometimes you'll get
> endgames, sometimes slashing attacks from the
> outset, sometimes complex
> middlegames -- but I also try to choose for each
> game one type of play that
> will be more likely to happen.
>
> - Ralph Betza
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
>
>


__________________________________________________
Correo Yahoo!
Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam ¡gratis!
Regístrate ya - http://correo.espanol.yahoo.com/

Thanks very much, Sam.

On 4/18/06, Sam Trenholme <samuel_trenholme@...> wrote:
>
> In more detail,
>
>
http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game=Optimized%20Chess%208H%20x%2010W\
%20-%20Mirror%20II&log=judgmentality-cvgameroom-2006-107-644&userid=judgmentalit\
y
> a.k.a http://tinyurl.com/gphsc was NRABQKBMRN instead
> of NRABKQBMRN (the kings and queens were accidently
> inverted).  I have deleted this preset.
>
> The other three presets,
>
>
http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game%3DOptimized+Chess+8H+x+10W+-+Mir\
ror+I%26settings%3DOptimized+Chess
> a.k.a http://tinyurl.com/kdtoc,
>
>
http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game%3DOptimized+Chess+8H+x+10W+-+Mir\
ror+II%26settings%3DOptimized+Chess
> a.k.a http://tinyurl.com/fk82l, and
>
>
http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game=Optimized%20Chess%208H%20x%2010W\
%20-%20Mirror%20I&log=judgmentality-cvgameroom-2006-107-643&userid=judgmentality
> a.k.a http://tinyurl.com/f7fr2 have the correct
> NRMBQKBARN setup.
>
> I note that Omegaman uses the "symmetric" castling for
> this setup (see
> http://www.chessvariants.org/index/displaycomment.php?commentid=13279
> ).  This is the same castling that Janus Chess uses:
> "When a player castles, his king goes to the square on
> the b or i-line, i.e., when a player castles short,
> his king moves three squares, and when he castles
> long, his king moves four squares. All other rules are
> as in normal chess."  This is different from
> traditional Capablanca Chess, where "the king always
> moves three squares towards the rook",
> Grotesque/Univers/Schoolbook Chess, where the king can
> move two, three, and sometimes four squares towards
> the rook, and the very flexible castling that Aberg's
> variation has.
>
> - Sam
>
> --- omegamani <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> escribió:
>
> > There are errors in some of the presets for
> > Optimized Chess 8H x 10W
> > that need to be corrected before anyone plays.
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Correo Yahoo!
> Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam ¡gratis!
> Regístrate ya - http://correo.espanol.yahoo.com/
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
I try to design for the length of the game -- adjusting the balance of force
and space to produce a shorter, tactical game or a longer, calmer game
according to the settings in which I see the game being played. I try to
start with an idea that people will find intriguing, so they will want to
try the game to see how that idea expresses itself on the board. I try to
keep the rules simple, so that people writing about the game don't need to
waste too many paragraphs explaining the rules. I try to make sure that the
play of the game can unfold in a number of ways, that sometimes you'll get
endgames, sometimes slashing attacks from the outset, sometimes complex
middlegames -- but I also try to choose for each game one type of play that
will be more likely to happen.

- Ralph Betza


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thank you for your attention to this detail. I had not in fact noticed that
this swapping had taken place in the original presentation, only that the
marshall and archbishop had swapped from Mirror I to Mirror II.

Here is a new invitation:

http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game=Optimized%20Chess%208H%20x%2010W\
%20-%20Mirror%20II&log=judgmentality-cvgameroom-2006-107-770&userid=judgmentalit\
y

http://tinyurl.com/evrtt

On 4/18/06, Sam Trenholme <samuel_trenholme@...> wrote:
>
>
>
http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game%3DOptimized+Chess+8H+x+10W+-+Mir\
ror+II%26settings%3DOptimized+Chess
> needs to have the queen and king swapped, compare with
> http://www.symmetryperfect.com/shots/opti/.  The two
> Optimized setups are identical mirror images of each
> other.
>
> --- Jeremy Good <chessvariants@...> escribió:
>
> > Greetings.
> >
> > There was a problem when I first submitted them,
> > with the placement of
> > knight and rook on one of the flanks. That problem
> > was corrected and I hope
> > they're okay now. Sorry for the sloppiness.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Jeremy
> >
> > On 4/18/06, omegamani <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > There are errors in some of the presets for
> > Optimized Chess 8H x 10W
> > > that need to be corrected before anyone plays.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > I try to design for the length of the game --
> > adjusting the balance of force
> > and space to produce a shorter, tactical game or a
> > longer, calmer game
> > according to the settings in which I see the game
> > being played. I try to
> > start with an idea that people will find intriguing,
> > so they will want to
> > try the game to see how that idea expresses itself
> > on the board. I try to
> > keep the rules simple, so that people writing about
> > the game don't need to
> > waste too many paragraphs explaining the rules. I
> > try to make sure that the
> > play of the game can unfold in a number of ways,
> > that sometimes you'll get
> > endgames, sometimes slashing attacks from the
> > outset, sometimes complex
> > middlegames -- but I also try to choose for each
> > game one type of play that
> > will be more likely to happen.
> >
> > - Ralph Betza
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been
> > removed]
> >
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Correo Yahoo!
> Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam ¡gratis!
> Regístrate ya - http://correo.espanol.yahoo.com/
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
I try to design for the length of the game -- adjusting the balance of force
and space to produce a shorter, tactical game or a longer, calmer game
according to the settings in which I see the game being played. I try to
start with an idea that people will find intriguing, so they will want to
try the game to see how that idea expresses itself on the board. I try to
keep the rules simple, so that people writing about the game don't need to
waste too many paragraphs explaining the rules. I try to make sure that the
play of the game can unfold in a number of ways, that sometimes you'll get
endgames, sometimes slashing attacks from the outset, sometimes complex
middlegames -- but I also try to choose for each game one type of play that
will be more likely to happen.

- Ralph Betza


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

game courier presets
optimized chess 8H x 10W

mirror I

http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game%
3DOptimized+Chess+8H+x+10W+-+Mirror+I%26log%3Djudgmentality-
cvgameroom-
2006-107-643%26submit%3DAccept

mirror II

http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game=Optimized%20Chess%
208H%
20x%2010W%20-%20Mirror%20II&log=judgmentality-cvgameroom-2006-107-
770&userid=judgmentality

I think these 2 presets are correct.
All others should have been deleted.

Keep in mind that there is only 1 unique game represented here via 2
equally valid mirror-images.

Most people would probably prefer the familiar look of "mirror I"
with the king on the right and the queen on the left (ala- chess).

Of course, Yahoo messed-up both incredibly-long links in the previous
message.

That's why I usu. try to replicate the longer urls with tinyurls.

On 4/18/06, omegamani <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
> Of course, Yahoo messed-up both incredibly-long links in the previous
> message.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
I try to design for the length of the game -- adjusting the balance of force
and space to produce a shorter, tactical game or a longer, calmer game
according to the settings in which I see the game being played. I try to
start with an idea that people will find intriguing, so they will want to
try the game to see how that idea expresses itself on the board. I try to
keep the rules simple, so that people writing about the game don't need to
waste too many paragraphs explaining the rules. I try to make sure that the
play of the game can unfold in a number of ways, that sometimes you'll get
endgames, sometimes slashing attacks from the outset, sometimes complex
middlegames -- but I also try to choose for each game one type of play that
will be more likely to happen.

- Ralph Betza


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

"Keep in mind that there is only 1 unique game represented here via 2
equally valid mirror-images."

Ah, I see. Now I understand why it was done that way. Interesting.

On 4/18/06, omegamani <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
> game courier presets
> optimized chess 8H x 10W
>
> mirror I
>
> http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game%
> 3DOptimized+Chess+8H+x+10W+-+Mirror+I%26log%3Djudgmentality-
> cvgameroom-
> 2006-107-643%26submit%3DAccept
>
> mirror II
>
> http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game=Optimized%20Chess%
> 208H%
> 20x%2010W%20-%20Mirror%20II&log=judgmentality-cvgameroom-2006-107-
> 770&userid=judgmentality
>
> I think these 2 presets are correct.
> All others should have been deleted.
>
> Keep in mind that there is only 1 unique game represented here via 2
> equally valid mirror-images.
>
> Most people would probably prefer the familiar look of "mirror I"
> with the king on the right and the queen on the left (ala- chess).
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
I try to design for the length of the game -- adjusting the balance of force
and space to produce a shorter, tactical game or a longer, calmer game
according to the settings in which I see the game being played. I try to
start with an idea that people will find intriguing, so they will want to
try the game to see how that idea expresses itself on the board. I try to
keep the rules simple, so that people writing about the game don't need to
waste too many paragraphs explaining the rules. I try to make sure that the
play of the game can unfold in a number of ways, that sometimes you'll get
endgames, sometimes slashing attacks from the outset, sometimes complex
middlegames -- but I also try to choose for each game one type of play that
will be more likely to happen.

- Ralph Betza


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Special thanks to Jeremy Good for creating 2 Game Courier presets from
scratch for Opti Chess.  Additional thanks to Jeremy Good & Sam
Trenholme for revising them to perfection in record time.

I note that Omegaman uses the "symmetric" castling for this setup.
__________________________________________________________________

Nevermind whether or not my justification in theory for symmetric
castling [explained elsewhere] works in your judgment.  There is
also a strong, practical reason to prefer it.

Take the example of Opti Chess:

1.  There are 2 equivalent E-W mirror-image representations of the
game- mirror I & II.

2.  There are 2 players- white & black.

3.  Each player has 2 flanks- east & west (or left & right, if you
prefer).
________

In terms of the pairs of destination squares involved in castling
(which must be memorized and anticipated to play well) ... with
symmetric castling there would be 1 possibility and with normal-
traditional castling there would be 8 possibilities.  [That decision
came easily for me.]

It distills to a what you honestly want for the players:

1.  To drive them crazy with pointless details (so you can be deeply
reverent to the ancient, overcomplicated method of castling used in
the standard game of 8H x 8W chess which incidentally, 8H x 10W chess
is NOT).

OR

2.  To give them a positive experience.
_______________________________________

Please heed John Kipling Lewis' "An Appeal For Simplicity"?

It is never too late to change the castling method used within
Schoolbook Chess.

In variants which oppose wazirs and ferzes in this way, a surface glance may
suggest these Wazirs and Ferzes are just one step away from exchanging with
one another. Not so. It takes two steps for a ferz or wazir to exchange with
an opposing ferz or wazir. That makes it analogous to FIDE chess in that it
takes two moves (For example 1. e4 d5 2. ed) to make an exchange. Only in
this case, it is harder to offer an immediate gambit since what ever piece
you advance (ferz or wazir) will be protected twice!

http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game=Miniature+Hierarchical+Chess&log\
=judgmentality-cvgameroom-2006-107-921


http://tinyurl.com/p8s5w

--


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On second glance, this is just incorrect; true for wazirs but not ferzes.

On 4/18/06, Jeremy Good <chessvariants@...> wrote:
>
> In variants which oppose wazirs and ferzes in this way, a surface glance
> may suggest these Wazirs and Ferzes are just one step away from exchanging
> with one another. Not so. It takes two steps for a ferz or wazir to exchange
> with an opposing ferz or wazir. That makes it analogous to FIDE chess in
> that it takes two moves (For example 1. e4 d5 2. ed) to make an exchange.
> Only in this case, it is harder to offer an immediate gambit since what ever
> piece you advance (ferz or wazir) will be protected twice!
>
>
http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game=Miniature+Hierarchical+Chess&log\
=judgmentality-cvgameroom-2006-107-921
>
>
> http://tinyurl.com/p8s5w
>
> --
>



--
I try to design for the length of the game -- adjusting the balance of force
and space to produce a shorter, tactical game or a longer, calmer game
according to the settings in which I see the game being played. I try to
start with an idea that people will find intriguing, so they will want to
try the game to see how that idea expresses itself on the board. I try to
keep the rules simple, so that people writing about the game don't need to
waste too many paragraphs explaining the rules. I try to make sure that the
play of the game can unfold in a number of ways, that sometimes you'll get
endgames, sometimes slashing attacks from the outset, sometimes complex
middlegames -- but I also try to choose for each game one type of play that
will be more likely to happen.

- Ralph Betza


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi.

I'm new here, and, since I can't, I don't know why, post in the page
my variation, and I would like some backup about it.

I don't even know if the pieces (at least the pawns I believe) are
new, or if this variant is new at all.

I named it Crowned Crazies because of the Betza's Nutty Knights, etc.

Is this setting, every piece has the option to make kings move. Kings
and Queens has no change. Castling and en passant captures remains the
same.

The pawns had a significant change. Now they have a double step option
for diagonals. Besides that, promotion became a tricky one time
chance. Since the pawns have the ability to move back in the board,
the first time it reaches the enemy side they have the option to
promote, if they choose not to, they become wandering pawns and cannot
promote again.

Again, I would like to know your thoughts about it. I believe that the
crowned knight and the "crowned pawn" are new pieces. Dragon King and
Dragon Horse are the crowned rook and bishop, not in this order, I guess.

Thank you all.

Claudio.

Think you are smart?  Lets see!  Take the IQ test below and find out
your scores!

[URL=http://emailmoneyback.com/ref/?o=136&u=2596]bring it on![/URL]

Um... your URL says something about money.  You should really try to hide
your spam better.

On Tue, 25 Apr 2006, thd1986 wrote:

> Think you are smart?  Lets see!  Take the IQ test below and find out
> your scores!
>
> [URL=http://emailmoneyback.com/ref/?o=136&u=2596]bring it on![/URL]
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

Hi.

I've been working around with some pieces and trying to figure it out
ir a chess board in real game playing.

One piece in particular had, in a first glance, won my heart, the sissa.

As some pieces she (in portuguese it would be female gender, we don't
have a neutral gender) looked like a Knightish moving piece (if you
think that a knight move like a half Y (one orthogonally and one
diagonally)) with infinite extension, like a Queen or a Rook.

But in a simetrical sissa article I've learned that she move not only
foward, but backward too! That made no sense, because it would force
her to have some moves like a Wazir, a Ferz, an Alfil or a Dabbabah.
Just moving foward and coming back in the diagonals. Is that right?

I have compilled all her movements, foward and backwards, from e4 in a
8x8 board, if someone wants to know, drop me a message.

Is that idea from the sissa, moving backwards too correct? Am I the
only who noticed the destinations from her backwards movements?

Thanks for you all.

Claudio.

Does she promote?

On Fri, 28 Apr 2006, clajagua31 wrote:

> Hi.
>
> I've been working around with some pieces and trying to figure it out
> ir a chess board in real game playing.
>
> One piece in particular had, in a first glance, won my heart, the sissa.
>
> As some pieces she (in portuguese it would be female gender, we don't
> have a neutral gender) looked like a Knightish moving piece (if you
> think that a knight move like a half Y (one orthogonally and one
> diagonally)) with infinite extension, like a Queen or a Rook.
>
> But in a simetrical sissa article I've learned that she move not only
> foward, but backward too! That made no sense, because it would force
> her to have some moves like a Wazir, a Ferz, an Alfil or a Dabbabah.
> Just moving foward and coming back in the diagonals. Is that right?
>
> I have compilled all her movements, foward and backwards, from e4 in a
> 8x8 board, if someone wants to know, drop me a message.
>
> Is that idea from the sissa, moving backwards too correct? Am I the
> only who noticed the destinations from her backwards movements?
>
> Thanks for you all.
>
> Claudio.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

No.

She's considered a first line piece, like a bishop or a rook.

Look at symetric sissa's games or the piececopledia entry at the
chessvariants sites.

Pints to you!

Claudio.

--- In chessvariants@yahoogroups.com, John Kipling Lewis <jklewis@...>
wrote:
>
>
> Does she promote?
>

Looks like from the diagram that she can go backwards?!?

John -

On Fri, 28 Apr 2006, clajagua31 wrote:

> Hi.
>
> I've been working around with some pieces and trying to figure it out
> ir a chess board in real game playing.
>
> One piece in particular had, in a first glance, won my heart, the sissa.
>
> As some pieces she (in portuguese it would be female gender, we don't
> have a neutral gender) looked like a Knightish moving piece (if you
> think that a knight move like a half Y (one orthogonally and one
> diagonally)) with infinite extension, like a Queen or a Rook.
>
> But in a simetrical sissa article I've learned that she move not only
> foward, but backward too! That made no sense, because it would force
> her to have some moves like a Wazir, a Ferz, an Alfil or a Dabbabah.
> Just moving foward and coming back in the diagonals. Is that right?
>
> I have compilled all her movements, foward and backwards, from e4 in a
> 8x8 board, if someone wants to know, drop me a message.
>
> Is that idea from the sissa, moving backwards too correct? Am I the
> only who noticed the destinations from her backwards movements?
>
> Thanks for you all.
>
> Claudio.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

get on to  www.freegames.coz.in
for free downloads of superb games and play online games
Totally free!!!!!

Here the link to the diagram and the game;

http://www.chessvariants.org/large.dir/symsissa.html

Hugs!

Claudio.