1. Do not answer rules questions on the list, even if they are not preceded
by a [RULES] note.
2. Old rules digests may be found in the Files section of the listserv:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MagiNation/files
Please check previous digests before asking a question to be certain it has
not been answered before.
3. Include [RULES] in the subject of all rules posts, otherwise the rules
team may miss the question for the digest.
4. We must stress again the first rule; those who continually violate this
will be in danger of moderation.


RT = Rules Team

IN THIS DIGEST:

Announcements and Clarifications
1. Some questions..
2. League Elder and Crushing Spells.
3. Riptide and affecting the hand.
4. Cleansing a Turned Creature.
5. Voice lessons.
6. Owinda's Gift and Charm.
7. Corrupt and affecting a Magi.
8. Stacking Jasker's Mask.
9. Stacking effects.
10. Arosa gets None for You.
11. Caps, reductions, and Move.
12. Your cards and your Magi's cards.
13. Crushing Darkness and restrictions.
14. Spellfire and Turn.
15. Orothean Belt conditions.
Non-Legal Limited cards

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CLARIFICATIONS

Voice of the Storm
Effect - Diplomacy: When you play a Creature, if it is Arderial and you have
an Orothe Creature in play, reduce the played Creature's cost by one. Or, if
the Creature played is Orothe and you have an Arderial Creature in play,
reduce the played Creature's cost by one. Dimplomacy may not reduce a
Creature's cost to less than one, and may not reduce its cost by more than
one.

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Sid Ben (magibrasil@...) writes:

1. Hello everyone, I have just 3 questions:

A - Can I use Warlum to play Kybar's Fang "for free"?

RT - Yes; If your Magi may legally play Kybar's Fang, yes; Warlum's Power
plays Relics ignoring all costs.

B - Spells that the oponent plays with Heart/Hand of Sky are considered
oposing spells for cards like Colossus? Since they are MY spells...

RT - Yes; Any card that an opponent plays/controls is an opposing, regardless
of owner.

C - If the oponent uses Shadow Cloak's power (don't remembder the name) and
on my turn I discard it with Relic Stalker, is the power still active?

RT - Yes; Discarding a Relic from play does not normally cancel any ongoing
effects it has.

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Sean Wallace (sean_p_wallace@...) writes:

2. Is League Elder allowed to cast the Crushing spell from the players region

of choice when he is revealed or is he considered to be a Universal Magi
that can play that Region without penalty?

RT - League Elder changes to the region named instead of Universal, meaning
he can play Crushing Spells of the appropriate region.

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Michael Welling (mdw005@...) writes:

3. I was playing Core (For some reason) and my opponent was playing Orothe
(League thing...ya know) and I had a good 27 cards in my hand or so, while he
was down to just 2. He proceeded to Riptide me. Here was the question.
Riptide can not normally be CSed, since it effects both hands, however, since
his hand was below 4 cards, he did not discard any cards, so coincidentally,
his hand was "not affected" by the spell. However, that means I could CS it
in that instance. So the question is: "Can I Climbing Staff a Riptide if my
opponent who cast it has less than 4 cards in his hand, since it does not
affect his hand coincidentally." I decided that since his strategy of
emptying his hand before Riptide was awful brave with Anti-discard so strong,
that I discarded all but 4 cards from my hand.

RT - You're right; Climbing Staff's current wording suggests that you have to
wait, let events unfold, then back up and undo them. Therefore, treat
Climbing Staff's second Effect as if it were phrased as follows:

"Effect: You may discard Climbing Staff from your hand or from play when an
opposing Spell, Power, or Effect would affect only your Magi or only your
hand. The Spell, Power, or Effect does nothing."

Also, affecting a hand, as currently defined:

Affect (Hand, Deck, and Discard Pile): The hand, deck, or discard pile is
affected either when the hidden contents of it are revealed (reveal your hand
to all players) or when they’re changed (searching your deck or discard pile
for a card and placing it in your hand). For example, drawing a card would
affect your hand and deck, because the contents of both are changed.

When a player uses a Riptide and their hand is not above four cards, then
their hand would not have their contents changed (by discarding), and would
therefore not be affected. This means that, in your example, only your hand
would be affected, and you could discard Climbing Staff to prevent Riptide
from affecting you.

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shen_dugan (douglascamp@...) writes:

4. After a great day at League my play group and I got into a discussion
on the way home about the Cleansing and Turn cards. In short we were
trying to figure out if the following combo would net the result that
I'll go into detail shortly.

Combo:
1) Use Cleansing to Cleanse the Turn card to Kybar's Teeth.
2) Locate a Pylofuf in play that has less than its Starting Energy.
The Pylofuf could be one that you've played.
3) Use Turn to (A) take over your opponent's Pylofuf, or (B) restore
your Pylofuf to its full energy. The main point is to make that one
Pylofuf a Core creature.
4) Use Cleansing to change the Core-Pylofuf under your control into a
Kybar's Teeth Pylofuf.

End Result Question:
By using Turn on the Pylofuf, then Cleansing it to Kybar's Teeth, do
all Pylofuf cards become Kybar's Teeth?

RT - No; Cleansing may only be used on non-Magi cards that are printed as
Core or considered to be printed as Core, i.e., an Entombed Spell (currently
the only two cards in the game that can edit printed values). Changing one
copy of a card in play to a different region doesn't apply to other copies of
it; otherwise, while that Pylofuf in play was Core, the Underneath player
would not be able to play anymore from hand because of regional restrictions.

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C. Doug (vampiresthemasquerade@...) writes:

5. rules team - do the 2 effects on voice of the storm
stack?

RT - There is only one Effect, but, no, the possibilities of that Effect do
not stack; for the sake of clarity, however:

"Effect - Diplomacy: When you play a Creature, if it is Arderial and you have
an Orothe Creature in play, reduce the played Creature's cost by one. Or, if
the Creature played is Orothe and you have an Arderial Creature in play,
reduce the played Creature's cost by one. Dimplomacy may not reduce a
Creature's cost to less than one, and may not reduce its cost by more than
one."

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Gregg Gargano (garganimal@...) writes:

6. A. Is the new Orothe league promo spell officially
MRP'd to draw 2 cards?

RT - Yes.

B. With Zannah (I'm sure this was covered at some
point in time), does my first attack (or spell that
would discard energy from one of my creatures) result
in no energy discard? ie, I have a Forest Hyren in
play with Zannah, if it attacks a Giant Baldar would
the Forest Hyren take any damage?

RT - Zannah was MRPed to opposing turns only; additionally, unlike Resistance
style effects, which prevent energy removal from ever being applied to what
they protect, Zannah waits for the removal to be applied, then removes the
removal, effectively reducing it to zero. Because of this, Piercing will
still supercede Charm.


C. My opponent has a pylofuf, digging goggles, and
strag's claws in play. I have a pair of handy dandy
yark gloves. The pylofuf has 5 energy. If the
pylofuf attacks one of my creatures, who dictates the
effects order and would i be able to "yark" it back
down to 5? or would the opponent get to choose the
yark gloves to go off first and then add one due to
the claws? What about if it had 6 energy?

RT - Active player's effects always resolve first; the Claws would add one
energy to the Pylofuf, then the Gloves will reduce it to its starting energy.

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dracomordag (dracomordag@...) writes:

7. I was thinking, seeing as corrupt technically affects a magi, and I
remember reading somewhere that nothing can affect a magi until they
take their first turn, wouldn't using a first turn corrupt, as many
decks do, be illegal? My memory is fuzzy, and I could be wrong. Also,
If you can use corrupt on a magi first turn, couldn't you Hubdra's
Spear them, or warriors boots a creature and attack, or any
magi-damaging spell for that matter? Maybe you can only do something
to affect a magi if it doesn't cause damage.

RT - Actually, Corrupt does not affect a Magi; choosing a card and affecting
it, while usually those actions follow hand in hand, are separate events.

Affect (Creatures, Magi, Relics, and Spells): A Creature, Magi, Relic, or
Spell is affected only when an event alters or would alter their game state
(changing their energy total, removing them from play, or otherwise doing
something that has a direct impact on the card) in some way because of the
type of card that they are (this can be as broad as “discard a Relic”
affecting a Relic to as narrow as “discard all Balamants affecting Balamant
Creatures).

Corrupt, while it chooses and attaches to a Magi, doesn't actually do
anything to that Magi; it's just there.

As for attaching Corrupt to your Magi, that can't happen if you have none in
play, but this is remedied by the player usually just attaching it to their
Magi.

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SSJ_Mato (c_radd@...) writes:

8. If there is a multiplayer game with two Kybars Teeth players and
both of those players are using Jasker's Mask, do the Energize
effects stack? Will all magi gain the extra 5 energize, making for
10 extra energy? Also, do the spell cost penalties from the mask
stack?

RT - Yes to both questions; Jasker's Mask's Effect does not limit itself to
only one being used at a time, so not only does the energize boost stack, but
the Spell cost penalty does as well.

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SSJ_Mato writes again:

9. If I am playing a Chogus/Perpetual Motion deck and have more than
one Crag Quor/Gratch/Xampf/Yebed out and the conditons for their
effects to trigger are met (with or without a Chogus, Garganor, or
Jagt), do those effects stack? I'm talking about Hunting Howl,
Rolling Stones, Wind Chill, that stuff. Would my magi gain energy
more than once? Would my KT creatures gain even more extra energy?
Would my opponent's creatures lose extra energy?

RT - Yes; none of those Effects state that they aren't cumulative, and so
they all 'stack'.

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Gregg writes again:

10. With Arosa's new wording, does the creature get
returned as the first step in Arosa's turn (before I
can utilize something like "None for you")?

RT - Yes; the beginning of the turn happens long before the first Spells,
Powers, and Relics step.

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Gregg writes again:

11. A. Just wanted to verify. . .a burrowed Akkar. If it
is attacked by a 10 energy creature the damage will
initially be reduced by 2, since the invulnerability,
and then be capped at 2. . .netting a 2 energy loss
for the Akkar, not 0. . .damage subtraction before
damage capping, correct?

RT - Yes; the general rule is that you apply all reductions before you apply
caps.

B. Syphon Vortex/Abraxim's Crown/Scroll of
Fire/Valkan. . .several Cald questions in this one.
If I dream burn/vortex a magi for X energy, does that
energy get placed on my magi? If I dream burn/vortex
(with a scroll of fire in play), does the vortex do
X+1 damage to the magi and would my magi get X, X+1,
or 0 energy back. Now apply the same question with
Valkan. . .who I'm assuming since he specifies
creatures that the +2 damage would not be applied.

RT - Both Valkan's and the Scroll's Effects only apply to energy discard from
Creatures, so in both cases, the energy removal will not be increased.

Additionally, for simplicity's sake, a move effect adds the amount of energy
that it discarded, i.e., reducing the discard reduces the add, and increasing
the discard increases the add. We apologize for any confusion over past
rulings on the matter.

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Jason Sniegowski (jsniegowski@...) writes:

12. So evil evu wouldn't be discarded by orwins ring???

(In reference to the ruling about Empress Gia in the previous Digest.)

RT - Yes, Evil Evu would; there is a distinction between the cards you as a
player has in play, as opposed to what your Magi has in play; Purity refers
to discarding cards you, as a player, have in play, including your Magi.

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Scott Hebert (b_tasogare@...) writes:

13. If I have a Mantle of Shadows in play, and I am not a
Shadow Magi, am I correct in believing that I can play
Crushing Darkness? This seems a little lopsided to
me. Also, if I am a Shadow Magi, a Mantle of Shadows
will not help me in playing Crushing Darkness,
correct?

RT - If your Magi is not a Shadow Magi, then they can play Crushing Darkness
if they have means of doing so (the Spell being Cleansed, having a Mantle of
Shadows, etc).

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syphon_vortex (holyknyte@...) writes:

14. a) Can you Turn a creature at it's starting energy with harror in
assumption that spellfire will do 1 damage to it?

Harror:

Whenever any player plays a spell, you may choose any one creature or
magi in play. discard 1 energy from the chosen reature or magi.

Turn: Choose any creature in play with less than it's starting
energy....

i'm going on that since you can't target the creature legally so you
can't turn it.

RT - No; you may not play a Spell if there will not be a valid choice
available to be made for it upon playing it. This is different from a 'legal'
choice; because a Fireball just requires a Creature be in play to choose when
you play it, even if the Fireball will do nothing to anything it can validly
choose, it can still be played. However, the Turn requires a Creature be in
play that it can validly choose (i.e., a Creature with less than its starting
energy) before you may attempt to play it, because the choice of that
Creature also determines the cost of the Spell. This does not inhibit your
ability to choose a different, valid Creature later.

For example, if there is an opposing Furok and a Leaf Hyren, the Furok with
three energy, and you play a Turn for seven energy to get the Furok, if
playing the Turn makes one energy move from the Hyren to the Furok, when it's
time to choose a Creature, you can choose the Hyren now, since it has
starting energy of X and has less than its starting energy.

In the specific case mentioned, Spellfire can enable you to choose a
different Creature, but only if there is another Creature in play that has
less than its starting energy with the same starting energy as your intended
Spellfire victim. So, again, with the Furok and Leaf Hyren, you could play
Turn with the Furok as the valid choice, Spellfire the Leaf Hyren, then take
the Leaf Hyren.

We would like to stress, this does not mean you may choose the Furok, then
choose another Creature later on in Turn's resolution; if you choose a
Creature that becomes illegal after choosing it, then Turn still fails with
no effect and is discarded.

b) can a Shell protect my orothe creatures from a cataclysm?? would
it make any difference with a relic on the board?

RT - Yes; Your Creatures are unaffected by the Spells of the chosen, opposing
Magi, and that generally means an opposing Cataclysm cannot discard your
Creatures; Shell does not interfere with Cataclysm as it is played, but as it
resolves.

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Scott Hebert asks again:

15. If I have Orothean Belt in play, and I Heal 5 of my
creatures for 1 energy each, will the Belt give each
creature an additional energy, or do I get nothing, or
6 total, or what?

In general, if I have a Spell that can add energy to
more than one creature at a time, if I play it while I
have the Belt in play, does the Belt give one energy
to each of the creatures targeted by the spell?

RT - Yes; each chosen Creature gains one energy, and the Belt does not need a
Spell to add energy to 'only' one Creature, just that a Spell add energy to a
Creature.

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NON-LEGAL LIMITED CARDS

The following list of cards is provided as a reference to cite current,
non-legal promotional cards, and their expected legal date:

Power of the Creators: No date currently planned.
Tony at a Con: No date currently planned.
Dan (including alternate artwork): No date currently planned.
Dan (Tony Jones Universal version): No date currently planned.
Ludi: No date currently planned.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------



1. Do not answer rules questions on the list, even if they are not preceded
by a [RULES] note.
2. Old rules digests may be found in the Files section of the listserv:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MagiNation/files
Please check previous digests before asking a question to be certain it has
not been answered before.
3. Include [RULES] in the subject of all rules posts, otherwise the rules
team may miss the question for the digest.
4. We must stress again the first rule; those who continually violate this
will be in danger of moderation.


















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]